nz to allow whaling

burnz · 02-04-2010, 11:40 AM

i simply dont understand their position to allow this

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2...section=justin

Quote:

The Federal Government says it is very concerned by New Zealand's compromise proposal with Japan to allow a set number of whales to be killed.

New Zealand has agreed to a plan that would give whaling countries the right to kill 1,500 whales a year, and its whaling commissioner plans to put forward the proposal at international talks in June.

**DJR-351** · 02-04-2010, 11:57 AM

Somebody's been greasing a few palms.....

**Polyal** · 02-04-2010, 12:25 PM

hate to say it but I think the sheepies are actually right on this one......

blanket banning is silly, if they are endangered then thats different but at the end of the day they are just big fish, and they are fishing.

Franco Cozzo · 02-04-2010, 12:32 PM

Japanese are really smart people, I'm sure they can come up with some method of farming whales

MAGPIE · 02-04-2010, 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

hate to say it but I think the sheepies are actually right on this one......

blanket banning is silly, if they are endangered then thats different but at the end of the day they are just big fish, and they are fishing.

Shows how much you know, they are not big fish they are mammals

This stance by NZ is disgraceful, as is its lack of support for Peter Bethune.

Sums up our f*#%ked up Govt to a tee !

nstg8a · 02-04-2010, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

hate to say it but I think the sheepies are actually right on this one......

blanket banning is silly, if they are endangered then thats different but at the end of the day they are just big fish, and they are fishing.

got it one... its just fishing, people need to open their eyes a little and be more concerned about stuff thats going on right in their backyard...

nstg8a · 02-04-2010, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAGPIE

as is its lack of support for Peter Bethune.

Sums up our f*#%ked up Govt to a tee !

why support a moron that drove a freakn awesome boat into the path of a much bigger heavier fishing boat, then boarded a foreign registered vessel illegally, which im pretty sure is still regarded as piracy...

if he did that off the coast off somalia he would have been shot on sight.

flappist · 02-04-2010, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAGPIE

Shows how much you know, they are not big fish they are mammals

This stance by NZ is disgraceful, as is its lack of support for Peter Bethune.

Sums up our f*#%ked up Govt to a tee !

Yep they are mammals.

Just like cows and sheep and pigs and goats etc.

Or is that different?

**Polyal** · 02-04-2010, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAGPIE

Shows how much you know, they are not big fish they are mammals

This stance by NZ is disgraceful, as is its lack of support for Peter Bethune.

Sums up our f*#%ked up Govt to a tee !

Ah was it the sheepies comment?

Fish/mammal whatever, I dont like the fact that the Japanese seem to not care about the laws and continue, thats not right.

But whaling has been around for a very long time, just like other forms of hunting etc and like I said, unless the ANIMAL is endangered whats the problem?

Just because we dont understand the lust for the meat doesn't mean we have the right to stop it.

Imagine if all the other forms of slaughter got as much air time as this, cows would run the world!

**Falcon Coupe** · 02-04-2010, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

hate to say it but I think the sheepies are actually right on this one......

blanket banning is silly, if they are endangered then thats different but at the end of the day they are just big fish, and they are fishing.

Not exactly, whales are mammals.
They can be trained and interact with humans, unlike fish.

**Polyal** · 02-04-2010, 01:21 PM

OK for the record, I dont care how they are defined; nor their intelligence. If it has gills, fins and can breathe underwater its a bloody fish, or fishlike animal.:thebirds:

Perhaps there is a bigger issue here?

GS608 · 02-04-2010, 01:25 PM

So how is whale hunting any different from breeding cows just to kill them for their meat? or culling kangaroos cause there are too many of them?

like polyal said, if they're endangered then fair enough.

nstg8a · 02-04-2010, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

OK for the record, I dont care how they are defined; nor their intelligence. If it has gills, fins and can breathe underwater its a bloody fish, or fishlike animal.:thebirds:

Perhaps there is a bigger issue here?

they dont breathe underwater... but i agree with you, as far as this conversation is concerned, theyre just a big stinky fish

**DJR-351** · 02-04-2010, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

OK for the record, I dont care how they are defined; nor their intelligence. If it has gills, fins and can breathe underwater its a bloody fish, or fishlike animal.:thebirds:

they don't have gill's and cannot breath under water, one outa three's not bad tho

burnz · 02-04-2010, 02:19 PM

cows are breed for human consuption.
roo's/crocks are plentifull.

whale's were plentifull (1930's) no so today due to over fishing, it is estemated less than plentifull stock of each species.

http://iwcoffice.org/conservation/estimate.htm

flappist · 02-04-2010, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by burnz

cows are breed for human consuption.
roo's/crocks are plentifull.

whale's were plentifull (1930's) no so today due to over fishing, it is estemated less than plentifull stock of each species.

http://iwcoffice.org/conservation/estimate.htm

So what you are saying is that you support whale farms to breed them for human consumption?

This is really an emotional argument that will, I suspect, get very ugly.

The anti whale hunters are absolutely sure that they are right and all "normal people" support their position. They have to support you, it only makes sense doesn't it. Anyone who disagrees is just less than human.

But then again I suspect the anti westerners who crashed the aircraft into the twin towers were absolutely sure that they were right and all "normal people" supported their position......

Just because you think something is right or wrong does not make it absolutely true. They are not your whales and this is not your planet. We have to share everything.

The Sea Shepherd terrorists are just very bloody lucky that the Japanese Navy has not sunk them yet. If it were US/Russian/North Korean/Chinese/French/just about every other large nation's fishing ships that were being attacked by pirates the response would be decisive and swift.

And for the record I do not support whaling but also do not support forcing my values and beliefs on others (or others forcing theirs on me).

MAGPIE · 02-04-2010, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

So what you are saying is that you support whale farms to breed them for human consumption?

This is really an emotional argument that will, I suspect, get very ugly.

The anti whale hunters are absolutely sure that they are right and all "normal people" support their position. They have to support you, it only makes sense doesn't it. Anyone who disagrees is just less than human.

But then again I suspect the anti westerners who crashed the aircraft into the twin towers were absolutely sure that they were right and all "normal people" supported their position......

Just because you think something is right or wrong does not make it absolutely true. They are not your whales and this is not your planet. We have to share everything.

The Sea Shepherd terrorists are just very bloody lucky that the Japanese Navy has not sunk them yet. If it were US/Russian/North Korean/Chinese/French/just about every other large nation's fishing ships that were being attacked by pirates the response would be decisive and swift.

And for the record I do not support whaling but also do not support forcing my values and beliefs on others.

They don't need the Jap Navy to sink them, the whaling ships do it themselves !

Without any repercussions I might add.

flappist · 02-04-2010, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAGPIE

They don't need the Jap Navy to sink them, the whaling ships do it themselves !

Without any repercussions I might add.

As they should.

If someone started annoying you as you went about your perfectly legal business because they did not like you e.g. a group of holden bogans harassing you while you were out in your ford and kept following you around getting in your way and generally giving you the poos because they do not like fords would you just accept it?

Or do something about it.........

Riksta · 02-04-2010, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

do not support forcing my values and beliefs on others (or others forcing theirs on me).

I just think its very unfortunate not everyone thinks the same way.

ryanstev · 02-04-2010, 02:54 PM

How long have we been trying to ban whaling? Hasn't worked, has it?
NZ is trying to compromise and I think it's well past time to try this.

Japan is a very proud nation, giving up on something is dishonourable.
Can you imagine them ever giving in to those dirty hippies on the boat?

The way to make Japan give up their whaling is to make them decide to give up on their own volition. A compromise like NZ is proposing is a step in that direction.

Adamz Ghia · 02-04-2010, 03:59 PM

One thing people have missed. They are doing it in our waters. So yes, according to our laws, they are doing the wrong thing and we have every right to defend this trritory. As for the comment regarding the Japanese navy sinking the conservation ships, the Japanese are damned lucky we are too weak to send ours down there.

We have staked our claim to these under the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea, to which Japan has signed up to.

flappist · 02-04-2010, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adamz Ghia

One thing people have missed. They are doing it in our waters. So yes, according to our laws, they are doing the wrong thing and we have every right to defend this trritory. As for the comment regarding the Japanese navy sinking the conservation ships, the Japanese are damned lucky we are too weak to send ours down there.

We have staked our claim to these under the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea, to which Japan has signed up to.

Maybe we don't want to be seen to be aiding terrorists and wish to use the correct legal channels.

We have laid claim huh?

Like Saddam Hussain laid claim to Kuwait or Stalin laid claim to most of Western Asia or China laid claim to Tibet?

That sort of claim?

nstg8a · 02-04-2010, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

They are not your whales and this is not your planet. We have to share everything.

.

incorrect

we are the dominant species, it is our planet and they are our whales.

if it isnt ours whos is it?

if the japanese want to eat them go for it i say, many different cultures eat many things we would find abhorrent, dosnt make it wrong, just different.

flappist · 02-04-2010, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nstg8a

incorrect

we are the dominant species, it is our planet and they are our whales.

if it isnt ours whos is it?

if the japanese want to eat them go for it i say, many different cultures eat many things we would find abhorrent, dosnt make it wrong, just different.

I meant share with other humans, as in other societies.

MAGPIE · 02-04-2010, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

As they should.

If someone started annoying you as you went about your perfectly legal business because they did not like you e.g. a group of holden bogans harassing you while you were out in your ford and kept following you around getting in your way and generally giving you the poos because they do not like fords would you just accept it?

Or do something about it.........

Like committing an illegal act

:

**Burnout** · 02-04-2010, 05:25 PM

Prohibition has never worked guys.

It failed to prevent prostitution.
It failed concerning the drinking of alcohol in the US.
It failed in Kenya in saving the Elephant.
Etc, ect.

Saving species only works when you place a value on it high enough to make them worthwhile having around.
Take a look at the human species for example.......

flappist · 02-04-2010, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAGPIE

Like committing an illegal act

:

Hmm but what sort of illegal act to commit?

I suppose you could put your car directly in front of their cars to force them to try end miss you but you would have to be careful that you were not so stupid as to put your car so close that they actually hit you.

And of course you could throw litter and noxious chemicals all over there cars.

And maybe break into their cars and try to sabotage them or interfere with the passengers and driver.

Are these the sort of illegal acts you are talking about?

nstg8a · 02-04-2010, 05:51 PM

and maybe try dragging a wire to entangle their props... which in those seas in my opinion is attempted murder, ship wouldnt last long in those seas with no propulsion.

i really struggle to see how people can justify actions like this just to save some whales which are not endangered, and depending on which sides rhetoric you read, some say thriving.

**DJM83** · 02-04-2010, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

Maybe we don't want to be seen to be aiding terrorists and wish to use the correct legal channels.

We have laid claim huh?

Like Saddam Hussain laid claim to Kuwait or Stalin laid claim to most of Western Asia or China laid claim to Tibet?

That sort of claim?

Good discussion yes, but lets not turn this into a political discussion please.

flappist · 02-04-2010, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJM83

Good discussion yes, but lets not turn this into a political discussion please.

Yes true Dallas but the point I was making was just because someone says they have laid claim to somewhere does not automatically make their claim valid or even indisputable.

The ONLY difference between a terrorist and a freedom fighter is which side of the fence you are seeing them from......