Falcon EcoBoost: The Fuel Efficiency Australians Need with the Performance They Want

[Joe5619]

Originally Posted by Nikked

but the engine is going to be worked hard all the time to work the same as the I6, it won't be reliable, remeber the starfire!

[jpd80]

The difference is that the I-4 Ecoboost ias intended to add sales to the Falcon portfolio while a V6 diesel
would most likely replace I-6 sales and if anything like Territory sales, the I-6 would be gone overnight....

[RASER]

Originally Posted by Nikked

Its part of fords global plan, one that could save the falcon...

A I6 no matter what tech, wont attract 4cyl buyers...

One would think this is last roll of the dice, if it does not sell, and the Falcon sales fall more and more, it will be axed.

Falcon cannot survive of 20,000units/pa [Its Mitsu 380 days again!]

Before they close it down, i will buy 1 last Falcon [had 3] a cab chassis ECOLPI and drive it till the wheels fall off, then go with a broken heart and buy a Commodore Ute prefer a c/chassi if it reterns [Did i mention a Commodore Ute like the Falcon Ute can fit a Chep pallet in between the wheelarches, did u get that T6 Ranger?]

[Nikked]

Originally Posted by Joe5619

you missed it...

Originally Posted by jpd80

The difference is that the I-4 Ecoboost ias intended to add sales to the Falcon portfolio while a V6 diesel
would most likely replace I-6 sales and if anything like Territory sales, the I-6 would be gone overnight....

It looks like ford are trying to make the two more unique, rather then the terri being seen as a falcon wagon in some aspects...

Ecoboost tech seems to be just as good as TDi anyway, and when diesel cost more at the pump, EB4 is probally more appealing amongst the sedan buyers...

[RASER]

[quote=Nikked][quote=RASER]


Lol, panelvan, coupe...

They can learn from VW Golf and build lots of body styles cheaply from the standard vehicle platform, not rocket science, the Terri is a Falcon in drag

Fairlane selling 5 cars a month...

How many does Holden do with the Statesman?, lots, and Holden make big money out of it, and even PM Julia gets to ride around in one!

THE problem with Ford in AUS is the management

[Nikked]

VW also sell cars world wide...not just australia, and share development cost over the VW autogroup...

[RASER]

Any LPG ECOLPI for the 4Booster donk?

Game On, gut feeling the aftermarket will be licking lips counting the days at tweaking [13s?/Q-Mile] these new 4 cyl. turboed donks!

[2011G6E]

Originally Posted by Cobramad

I disagree that the time wasn't right for a 4cyl large car, its just that the engine was a total piece of junk, thirsty, coarse and underpowered. Noted motoring journalist, the late Peter Wherret went to the trouble of transplanting the Mitsubish 2.6 4cylinder and 5speed 'box into the Commodore. It was called the "Comma", referring to the pause one would make before continuing. It went as hard as the Holden 6cyl and still used less fuel. There was no way in the world that Mitsubishi, who at the time were selling the most popular mid-sized car in the country, would ever have let anyone else have that engine/trans combo. That experiment made serious food for thought.
EB4 allows Ford to broaden its appeal to potential purchasers, which it desperately needs at present. Im hanging out to drive it and see for myself how well it stacks up as an alternative to the I6. It could be a winner..

Sorry, I hadn't heard of that one! Sounds great...the Astron 2.6 was the pick of the litter when it came to four cylinder engines at that time.

I think they're totally justified in quoting fuel figures on European based cars giving results from premium unleaded...in most places the "normal" unleaded is what we call "premium".

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by Nikked

you missed it...




It looks like ford are trying to make the two more unique, rather then the terri being seen as a falcon wagon in some aspects...

Ecoboost tech seems to be just as good as TDi anyway, and when diesel cost more at the pump, EB4 is probally more appealing amongst the sedan buyers...

Ecoboost doesn't carry a $3,500 price premium like the diesel either...

[RASER]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Ecoboost doesn't carry a $3,500 price premium like the diesel either...

+1

And @ US$1.06 to our $1, the US built Ecobooster donk could well have been a fair bit less to make than the IL6, only Ford HQ knows the exact figure

I appreciate the way it goes, and its lower fuel use, but its not my cup of tea

All we need now is the WRX crowd fitting BOV's to them! :-)

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by RASER

+1

And @ US$1.06 to our $1, the US built Ecobooster donk could well have been a fair bit less to make than the IL6, only Ford HQ knows the exact figure

I appreciate the way it goes, and its lower fuel use, but its not my cup of tea

All we need now is the WRX crowd fitting BOV's to them! :-)

There is a 2.7 V6 in DI and in Ecoboost under development for use in a lot of US vehicles,
the little V6 Ecoboost should be around 240 Kw and 510 nm, now that's an engine....

[naddis01]

Originally Posted by RASER

How many does Holden do with the Statesman?, lots, and Holden make big money out of it, and even PM Julia gets to ride around in one!

THE problem with Ford in AUS is the management

Lots being 100-150 per month meaning they won't be able to justify a LWB with the next commodore. By the way there is no Statesman anymore. They fiddled with the names and it is now Caprice.

[Brazen]

Originally Posted by RASER

Sorry, i am not falling for it and dont like it

Falcon does not need a another petrol donk.

What they should have done is fit the Terri TDI diesel into the Falcon, that would sell and 1200km range, country buyers would love it.

And they have made the IL6 look poor/odd against this new donk, if the gave the IL6 a fighting chance, and REALLY invested in it, ie direct injection, displacement on demand, high compression, stop/start technology, weight loss, it would kick the ECOBUST a/ss from here to kingdom come and back i think the ECO nonsense has been pushed into the Falcon by HQ in USA

My 2 cents worth!

and put it in the ute

[RASER]

Originally Posted by naddis01

Lots being 100-150 per month meaning they won't be able to justify a LWB with the next commodore. By the way there is no Statesman anymore. They fiddled with the names and it is now Caprice.

Stand corrected, now Caprice [More mature name, like Crown is to VB!]

The LWB's future depends on USA law enforcement export sales, i also believe that the wheelbase is the same as the Ute, so i can see them selling it into the future, a great sole niche-product since Ford walked away from it.

[jpd80]

Originally Posted by RASER

How many does Holden do with the Statesman?, lots, and Holden make big money out of it, and even PM Julia gets to ride around in one!

Statesman is about 150/mth here, 150/mth caprice PPV and around 4,000/year to Middle East - that's around 7,600 to 8,000/year.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by RASER

Stand corrected, now Caprice [More mature name, like Crown is to VB!]

The LWB's future depends on USA law enforcement export sales, i also believe that the wheelbase is the same as the Ute, so i can see them selling it into the future, a great sole niche-product since Ford walked away from it.

I don't think ute is LWB is it.

The Caprice has bombed. Won't be long before it drops to double figures a month here. Ford was right to drop Fairlane, the LWB market is dead. As much as we didn't want it to happen, it needed to.

[naddis01]

Originally Posted by RASER

Stand corrected, now Caprice [More mature name, like Crown is to VB!]

The LWB's future depends on USA law enforcement export sales, i also believe that the wheelbase is the same as the Ute, so i can see them selling it into the future, a great sole niche-product since Ford walked away from it.

They are selling around 100/month there as well. Still not enough to justify it's existence.

Ute isn't LWB.

[Joe5619]

[QUOTE=RASER][quote=Nikked]

Originally Posted by RASER

Lol, panelvan, coupe...

They can learn from VW Golf and build lots of body styles cheaply from the standard vehicle platform, not rocket science, the Terri is a Falcon in drag

Fairlane selling 5 cars a month...

How many does Holden do with the Statesman?, lots, and Holden make big money out of it, and even PM Julia gets to ride around in one!

THE problem with Ford in AUS is the management

Actually Holden sell 0 Statesman, yes NIL. It sold that badly they too dropped it.. They only sell Caprice now & that would be very very very very luck to get over 150 a month.. Times have change!!

[Elks]

I'm on record of being a big fan of the EcoBoost concept. It was always going to work. It will be a stunner. Low pressure boost giving 'displacenment on demand"

It amazes me that the same meatheads who think that that you can build a 500kw 4.0 I6 in their back, think it's impossible for FoMoCo with all its resources to build a 180kw 2.2 I4.

[prydey]

some people really need to let go of the cylinder count part. just forget that its a 4 cyl!!

350nm @ 2000rpm means you won't be revving tits off anything to get moving. this thing will have performance similar to BA falcon.

the I6 should now be XR6 only! make the xr6 something different and special again.

[falconnut]

Bring on the V6 and Diesel Ecoboost!

[Windsor220]

Originally Posted by Nikked

Actually Holden sell 0 Statesman, yes NIL. It sold that badly they too dropped it.. They only sell Caprice now & that would be very very very very luck to get over 150 a month.. Times have change!!

Thats incorrect. The car itself was never dropped. As said before, Holden just changed the names around. What used to be Statesman is now the Caprice. What used to be Caprice is now the Caprice V.

[Brazen]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

I don't think ute is LWB is it.

The Caprice has bombed. Won't be long before it drops to double figures a month here. Ford was right to drop Fairlane, the LWB market is dead. As much as we didn't want it to happen, it needed to.

It also hasnt been touched externally for 6 years. Having said that, LWB is a niche it's future lies in exports or vehicles for overseas consumption.

Globally it outsells the Falcon ute and is a high-margin vehicle in some markets: China, South Korea, Australia.

[Cobramad]

In the end, time will be judge as to how durable and reliable the EB4 will be. I believe it will be as reliable as any modern engine on the market today and at least gives Ford a chance to retain those who shop for vehicles purely on fuel economy numbers. Sill reckon it would tune up very well and if it is as sweet a motor as the venerable SR20 Nissan motor, may end up with as great a cult following.

[phillyc]

Can we get back ON TOPIC?

The topic is about the EcoBoost Falcon.

6L/100km economy will get EB Falcon from Sydney to Brisbane on a smaller tank of fuel than the Commodore needs to go the lesser distance of Sydney to Melbourne with a bigger tank.

I think they should use a similar advert to the Territory. "Over 1100km from a tank? Get out of town!"

Comparing the power / torque and economy figures against Mazda 3 is essential too. The next gen engine in the Mazda 3 is coming soon, so Ford better be quick on this.

[Polyal]

Agreed mate.

It is now time for Ford to grow a set and start directly comparing, more-so because its in their favour now!

[prydey]

speaking of which cars to target, i think they should target any car within its range that could help its image. camry, accord/accord euro, i45, optima, etc.

they may not win over many customers who were looking at any of those vehicles, but they just need to make sure they are in the frame.

this is a first for the ford world, so there is a lot riding on it. not sales as such, but just how the car goes in the real world. people associate '4cyl in a large car' with 'underpower' and 'overweight' etc. its evidenced on here even. people focus on the 4cyl bit and not the numbers.

if it was a diesel, and was producing 350nm @ 2000rpm, the response would be a lot different i feel. i think this engine 'on paper' should perform better than a diesel as it has a fair whack of power to go with the torque.

if it has 350nm @ 2000 rpm, then at 1000 - 1500 rpm theres a good chance torque is still at a reasonable level. the biggest thing in fighting fuel consumption is getting the weight up and moving. these figures combined with the gearing should get the job done nicely. once up and moving, the power and torque needed is minimal. this is why driving style in traffic can make a big difference in larger cars.

its sure on my radar for the future. i can match fords official figure on the highway in my fg (loaded even) so 6l/100km is very attractive to me as i use my car to travel interstate on family trips every year. i wonder how that would stack up against ecoLPi. it would all depend largely on pump price.

[Cobramad]

Will EB4 be available as both a manual and an automatic?

[Polyal]

Originally Posted by Cobramad

Will EB4 be available as both a manual and an automatic?

Looking at dumping on in the capri?

Unfortunately the populous is generally lazy and making a manual just for this car wont happen. It would be awesome in a capri or escort!

[prydey]

Originally Posted by jpd80

Greenvehicleguide has the figures up and they are impressive- LINK

Ecoboost gives fuel economy figures similar to Diesel Territory

Ecoboost Falcon:
Combined - 8.1 l/100km
Urban - 11.8 l/100 km
Extra Urban - 6.0 l/100 km

Compared to 4.0 XT:
Combined - 9.9 l/100km
Urban - 14.6 l/100 km
Extra Urban - 7.2 l/100 km

3.0 SIDI Omega:
Combined - 8.9 l/100km
Urban - 12.3 l/100 km
Extra Urban - 6.9 l/100 km

another comparo

Ecoboost Falcon 2.0L 4cyl (T), Auto 6 speed:
Combined - 8.1 l/100km
Urban - 11.8 l/100 km
Extra Urban - 6.0 l/100 km

Toyota Camry 2.5L 4cyl, Auto 6 speed
Combined - 7.8
Urban - 10.9
Extra Urban 6.0

Honda Accord Euro 2.4L 4cyl, Auto 5 speed
Combined - 8.9
Urban - 12.3
Extra Urban - 6.9

Mazda 6 2.5L 4cyl, Auto 5 speed
Combined - 8.7
Urban - 11.9
Extra Urban - 6.8

i used all auto's to keep it 'apples for apples'. some manual figures were more efficient.

as you can see, the ecoboost falcon is right in the thick of it. its all up to image and perception now. if all the members on here want the falcon to survive, they should do their part and keep any negative comments to themselves.