SA mid range DUI punishments - what the?

[DOC]

Originally Posted by ea90gl

Out of ALL serious accidents that have occurred over time since things have been recorded, can somebody please let me know how many of these have been a result of the convicted driver having a BAC of 0.08?

I think he said "I am only a little bit over" (from memory he was even smiling and joking a little / did not know it was him at the time, or it me be he would not have thought things were funny) or words to those effects, the other guys were only a little bit dead or in ICU struggling to live.

He was branded / nick named Killer and had to leave town to start a new life, Your just very lucky all you hit was a roo, other than that, stories sound similar, anyone would not have stopped etc etc.

Again wish you the best outcome given your plot. Never seen any winners in this game, start looking at how incredibly fortunate you are (your not facing all of the crap as above), over and above the world is wrong, why this, what that blame game.

[STEALTHY]

Originally Posted by ea90gl

To repeat myself, my original point was how does the penalty fit the crime committed?

You have decided to get behind the wheel under the influence of alcohol without any regard for other road users, what do you think would be an appropriate punishment?

Calling people who disagree with you 'braindead' is quite laughable. I (and i'm guessing those others) dont have a DUI. You do. Yet we're the braindead ones ;) Luckily you didn't kill an entire family

[ea90gl]

What a waste of time it has been posting my initial post and replying at all.

It is quite clear how the current laws have been able to be put in place in this country of ours. Even after explaining my situation and clearly stating that I have committed a crime and am completely able to accept a suitable punishment (although questioning the severity of the punishment according to the crime) I still get hit with the same old lines.

It's also funny how the majority of real life people I have spoken about in regards to my matter have actually seen where I am coming from and also question the current legal system in place. But of course the internet provides another world of arm chair experts and ******* who love to put their own 2 cents in.

Anyway enough is enough, can the mods please close the thread.

[STEALTHY]

Originally Posted by ea90gl

What a waste of time it has been posting my initial post and replying at all.

It is quite clear how the current laws have been able to be put in place in this country of ours. Even after explaining my situation and clearly stating that I have committed a crime and am completely able to accept a suitable punishment (although questioning the severity of the punishment according to the crime) I still get hit with the same old lines.

It's also funny how the majority of real life people I have spoken about in regards to my matter have actually seen where I am coming from and also question the current legal system in place. But of course the internet provides another world of arm chair experts and ******* who love to put their own 2 cents in.

Anyway enough is enough, can the mods please close the thread.

You still didn't answer.

What do you feel would be a suitable punishment for driving drunk? Just a point off your license? A small fine? Nothing?

[tonys6550]

Originally Posted by ea90gl

What a waste of time it has been posting my initial post and replying at all.

It is quite clear how the current laws have been able to be put in place in this country of ours. Even after explaining my situation and clearly stating that I have committed a crime and am completely able to accept a suitable punishment (although questioning the severity of the punishment according to the crime) I still get hit with the same old lines.

It's also funny how the majority of real life people I have spoken about in regards to my matter have actually seen where I am coming from and also question the current legal system in place. But of course the internet provides another world of arm chair experts and ******* who love to put their own 2 cents in.

Anyway enough is enough, can the mods please close the thread.

Really, What did you expect!

[X-AHH]

Your initial post wasn't a waste of time

The entire thread will serve as a reminder to anybody who read the content or contributed that questioning the fairness of punishment for a crime doesn't change anything.

[XB GS 351 Coupe]

Originally Posted by ea90gl

What a waste of time it has been posting my initial post and replying at all.

It is quite clear how the current laws have been able to be put in place in this country of ours. Even after explaining my situation and clearly stating that I have committed a crime and am completely able to accept a suitable punishment (although questioning the severity of the punishment according to the crime) I still get hit with the same old lines.

It's also funny how the majority of real life people I have spoken about in regards to my matter have actually seen where I am coming from and also question the current legal system in place. But of course the internet provides another world of arm chair experts and ******* who love to put their own 2 cents in.

Anyway enough is enough, can the mods please close the thread.

Mate you have a problem and sound like you do this regularly, and now you are annoyed you got caught.

It's not a difficult task to not drink alcohol and drive as a matter of fact it's really really simple.

Drink alcohol do not get behind the wheel, done.

Why should anyone including the judge care about your financial and personal and business situation if you could not care the least yourself. If any of those things mattered and you cared about your kids, family or business you would not be driving drunk.

See I care about my kids, my job and my income which is 100% dependant on my license and has been since I was 19, so I do not drive after consuming alcohol.

[arronm]

Dude you drove drunk, the law has BAC and fines for those levels. It has nothing to do with I am fine after X amount of beers and feel fine to drive

Affected more/ less. Doesn't matter. That's what BAC is for

For me fines and loss of licence is not the main deterrent for me not to drive drunk. It's others on the road and what may happen.

I can pay the fine and get my license back, but I can't give someone their life back

Yep you said it. Drunk drivers are scum who only think of themselves and they get what they deserve

[Junkyard-Dog]

Originally Posted by ea90gl

What a waste of time it has been posting my initial post and replying at all.

It's also funny how the majority of real life people I have spoken about in regards to my matter have actually seen where I am coming from and also question the current legal system in place. But of course the internet provides another world of arm chair experts and ******* who love to put their own 2 cents in.

Anyway enough is enough, can the mods please close the thread.

You don't get to close a thread just because it isn't going the way you had hoped. You wanted to know what others thought of your decision to drink and drive. Now you know.

Originally Posted by ea90gl

It is quite clear how the current laws have been able to be put in place in this country of ours. Even after explaining my situation and clearly stating that I have committed a crime and am completely able to accept a suitable punishment (although questioning the severity of the punishment according to the crime) I still get hit with the same old lines.

Yes, it is clear how they have been put in place. A lot of people have been killed by drunk people that were stupid enough to drive. Loss of license actually seems to be a perfectly suitable punishment for the crime committed.

The reason you "get hit with the same old lines" is because some people here have experienced the carnage that drunk drivers can cause. If you knew somebody who had been killed or disabled because of another person's decision to run the gauntlet, you would have a different mentality.

[Express]

Originally Posted by ea90gl

Wow, what a can of worms I have obviously opened............................................ However each type offence that is committed is apparently portrayed as the same amount of evil?

All the questions you’ve asked of the braindead forum members in this post should be asked of the Magistrate when you represent yourself in Court.

If you feel you need to play one crime against another as your defence I’m sure they’ll give you the short answer.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by ea90gl

What a waste of time it has been posting my initial post and replying at all.

It is quite clear how the current laws have been able to be put in place in this country of ours. Even after explaining my situation and clearly stating that I have committed a crime and am completely able to accept a suitable punishment (although questioning the severity of the punishment according to the crime) I still get hit with the same old lines.

It's also funny how the majority of real life people I have spoken about in regards to my matter have actually seen where I am coming from and also question the current legal system in place. But of course the internet provides another world of arm chair experts and ******* who love to put their own 2 cents in.

Anyway enough is enough, can the mods please close the thread.

Where you have gone wrong is you believe that your crime is far less serious than all the others you mention. This is the problem. You don't seem to recognise the seriousness of DUI. It is this blatant disregard that has people fired up.

So, what do you think is a suitable punishment?

Will you still drink and drive in the future?

If you answer yes to the second question then clearly you are right. The punishment didn't fit the crime.

[Nanoraptor]

Originally Posted by ea90gl

RTA says to jump off a cliff, you jump off a cliff?

The statement re: the RTA above isn't a request or command to jump off a cliff or to crash a car, it's a statement of fact regarding demonstrated risks at different blood alcohol levels.

It's obtained from collected data showing that people driving with blood alcohol levels >=0.05 make up a substantial proportion of crashes compared to those with no alcohol in their system. From memory the 2/6/25 numbers are from a monash study that revealed some incredible drops in the number of fatal crashes for sober drivers compared to drunk drivers.

It's even worse when considering *fatal* road accidents. 0.35% of the population are picked up with >=0.05% BAC in RBTs, but ~37% of fatal accidents involve the at-fault driver being over the same BAC. That's alcohol working to make sure it makes a fatal accident near a hundred times more likely.

That collected data that boson stated above isn't the RTA telling you to do something.

It's just information flowing from the already dead to the living.

It's a warning.

[irvinnie]

Do yourself a favour and go and find the historical data for the number of road fatalities recorded in Australia over the last forty years. You will see two quite distinctive drops in the number of deaths. Those two drops were after the introduction of random breath testing and the compulsory wearing of seat belts. It is very easy to see what affect drink driving had on our roads. Whether you choose to believe it or not drink driving kills. It is for this reason that magistrates take a serious view to it and punish as such.

[The Yeti]

OP put simply your an idiot who thinks he's badly done by because you got behind the wheel to get a dodgy take out after having a few

Please do the forum a favour and print a transcript of this thread for the court and highlight your posts and replies. I'm sure it will help your case

As for the people you have spoken to agreeing with you

Did you ever stop to think the just smiled and nodded while inside thinking, this guys an idiot

[Ansimp]

The same people that believe " ever K over is a killer " obviously believe that anything over .05 makes you a "killer". I am amazed that I have managed to drive in other countries where these levels ( our maximums ) are well below theirs, and at their levels I have not created carnage every where I drove or rode.
That being said from what I have witnessed good luck can often be more beneficial than excellent driving skills!

[Vesper Martini]

Originally Posted by ea90gl

I consumed approximately 5 standard strength beers over a 3-4 hour period after work. That particular night was take out night and seeing as the wife was not well I decided to head out and get some dinner. taken back to the station where the secondary test was performed which recorded a BAC of 0.082. I was personally surprised by this but at the end of the day it was what it was.

I have a place in country VIC, and I often head there late on a Friday night with my family.
It scares the crap out of me that Guys like you are on the road.
So basically you were too lazy to cook your sick wife dinner so around 8pm? decided to go get takeaway.

0.082 suggest you either had more than your are saying or you cant handle alcohol.
either way I hope you learn your Lesson

[b0son]

Originally Posted by ea90gl

RTA says to jump off a cliff, you jump off a cliff?

You asked for stats, I gave them. You have a go at me.

I suspect you're going to have a fun time in court when you are asked to explain yourself....

[baxtc1]

6 months loss of licence is a fairly light punishment for drink driving.

[raised by monkeys]

Originally Posted by ea90gl

Since when did the punishment for DUI become so ridiculous compared to the crime in the state of SA?

So basically I will most likely be losing my licence for a 6 months period shortly.

I will try to keep my story short and simple - in October of last year I consumed approximately 5 standard strength beers over a 3-4 hour period after work. That particular night was take out night and seeing as the wife was not well I decided to head out and get some dinner. Without going into the finer details, on the way a kangaroo ended up jumping out in front of my vehicle which I ended up hitting. Not even a skilled racing driver could of avoided this given the road/situation and timing in which it all happened. I decided to stop just on the side of the road and a good Samaritan must of heard the impact and decided to call the emergency services. Along came the services as well as the police who of course had to perform an alcohol breath test. Low and behold I was over the limit and was taken back to the station where the secondary test was performed which recorded a BAC of 0.082. I was personally surprised by this but at the end of the day it was what it was.

Basically what occurred that night could of happened to any one whether or not you were straight, drunk, high on coke, a person who has never touched any form of brain altering substances etc but what happened did happen so as mentioned it was what it was. This type of offence is also my first and I have a relatively clean record in regards to previous driving offences.

Anyway, I am currently self-employed and am the sole provider with a wife who does not work looking after our two very young boys (one having a mild disability and requires regular therapy of various sorts). I have enlisted the aid of a lawyer to help fight the case which has cost me thousands of dollars and the loss of licence will ultimately cost me many more thousands of dollars over the long run. All this is basically because I was found guilty of a mid-range DUI offence (0.002 above a low-range offence which would ultimately result in just a fine and away you go).

All of the above is completely disregarded and there is absolutely no way anything is taken into account in order to offer any form of leniency whatsoever in regards to the offence committed.

From research I have performed and also other cases I have witnessed personally at court hearings I have come up with the following (I could go on for quite some time);

You are able to break the law numerous times (speeding, mobile phone usage while driving etc) and are able to get a good behavior bond due to loss of demerit points. Don't they harp on about how dangerous the above offences are?

You are able to perform theft and assault and be let off on a good behavior bond seeing as it is a first offence and a criminal record could possibly effect your work and income

You are able to perform a break and enter and be let off with a slap on the wrist

Many other more serious crimes are able to be committed and you are able to get let off very easily.

I also know of another driver who was found guilty of a high-range DUI offence. He stupidly went out driving (BAC was recorded at 0.227 at time of incident) and ended up crashing into a parked car which was of low value. His ultimate punishment was a loss of licence for 18 months, the loss of his own vehicle (valued at approximately $2000) and he had to fork out for the vehicle he wrote off which was valued at $3500. Luckily for him, he was able to get a lift to and from work from a co-worker which he is able to take advantage of for the complete period of his loss of licence. At the end of the day this guy is actually more better off than myself and I'd personally rather be in his shoes than mine at the moment.

So is any body out there able to explain to me how these current DUI penalties are suited to the actual "crime" committed? I definitely do not condone any form of drink driving and if you happen to be drunk and end up causing a substantial accident due to being completely intoxicated then you should be locked away for good.

And last but not least, can the do-gooder's who are brainwashed by the media or whatever else please **** off and refrain from posting in this thread. I am not wanting to hear the same old ****** line of "you do the crime, you do the time" since obviously the time does not suit the crime committed. It is obviously the do-gooder attitude that allows these laws and penalties to be put in place

According to SAPOL the leading death toll in SA is road deaths and the reason why theyre so hot on associated traffic offences. Just look the saturation of SA traffic cameras and the cost of ensuing fines and focus on SAPOL presence on the roads.

In 2007 I was done DUI and blew .072. This came with 6 month on the spot loss of license and a further 6 months when it went to court + fines. I feel your pain. But as said earlier chalk it up. State laws cannot be compared because theyre individual state laws not federally enforced leaving states to develop their own policies and laws.

[blk6t]

I have been through the process, not for drink driving but for "dangerous driving"...basically overtook a truck on a rural road and did get to a stupid speed. I did have to go to court and it was a nervous experience. But did the crime and the time off the road. Something that changed my driving mindset forever.

The community frowns upon drink drivers and as such magistrates need to appease the community when sentencing, but without being too severe. Any unnecessary severity is often met with an appeal and if this goes your way (which is usually does), it looks bad on the magistrate. So there is a fine line.

But given it's mid range, you will definitely do time off the road, I think you will do 6 months. Low range offenders often get Section 10, which is rare but you can query about an interlock, I am not sure of these rules and when available.

I would suggest getting a good lawyer, good reference letters and be prepared for a grilling from the magistrate. Often doing a drink drivers impact course (1 day) looks good in the magistrates eyes, shows your remorseful and proactive.

Best thing is to learn and never do it again, you will be in for a worse shock if you get caught again. You would then be looking at years off the road and possible community service sentence.

[blueoval]

ea90gl - I don't need to wrap you over the knuckles any more than the majority of posters have here already. I really feel for you on this. It's a terrible situation to be in.

In saying this, if I were in your position at that time though, I would have ordered home delivery if you both couldn't be bothered cooking. 5 drinks would have me pretty out of it in that short amount of time. I drink wine and thats easily a bottle to myself and I know I get sleepy after 3 glasses.

It's all in hind sight now though. Sorry my post is not helpful.

[ltd]

I've seen a few people get genuinely caught out and quite surprised that they were over the limit. I've also seen recidivists.
I think first time offenders in extenuating circumstances such as the OP (self employed) would learn a more valuable lesson with an interlock and some form of mandatory education/community service.
Yes, the OP was at fault for the crime (which he has admitted), but as we're all individuals with different circumstances in our lives I think a blanket ban is a little excessive. Further, we've all done stuff in our lives where we thought we were doing the right thing, only to realise the consequences too late.

To illustrate my point, look at the consequences of the OP and a hypothetical.
The OP is done for being over, loses his license for 6 months, pays a solicitor thousands, pays a large fine and his livelihood is adversely affected. Possible financial cost? In the tens of thousands.

Compare that to a dole bludging recidivist. Gets done for being over. Loses license for a further 6 months, gets legal aid, livelihood not financially affected - even gets a discount on the fine. Possible financial cost? A couple of hundred dollars.

One contributes to society (through taxation) and one takes from society (through welfare).
So of the two who is more likely to learn a very valuable lesson?

I'm not going to condemn the OP without knowing his situation, but I am going to agree that the punishments are manifestly stupid for not measuring the impact they will have on the individual - one who loses much versus one who won't be affected at all.

[Top_Ghia]

Originally Posted by baxtc1

6 months loss of licence is a fairly light punishment for drink driving.

That's right. Keep it up and you'll go to prison.

[ronwest]

I usually don't weigh into these threads but regardless of anything else, for the beak, you will need to demonstrate that you "get it", are remorseful, and will make it your mission in life to not ever do such a dumb thing again.
If you are genuine it may do you some good.
If you try to bull**** your way through it it will definitely do you harm.
Ball is in your court, champ.

[STEALTHY]

Originally Posted by ltd

I've seen a few people get genuinely caught out and quite surprised that they were over the limit. I've also seen recidivists.
I think first time offenders in extenuating circumstances such as the OP (self employed) would learn a more valuable lesson with an interlock and some form of mandatory education/community service

If he was just over low range, people might have some sympathy (i wont because you shouldn't be drinking and driving, regardless of the legal limits to avoid this exact situation) but he blew mid range. Thats not 'just a slip', thats well over and getting into plastered territory.

[tonys6550]

Originally Posted by ltd

I've seen a few people get genuinely caught out and quite surprised that they were over the limit. I've also seen recidivists.
I think first time offenders in extenuating circumstances such as the OP (self employed) would learn a more valuable lesson with an interlock and some form of mandatory education/community service.
Yes, the OP was at fault for the crime (which he has admitted), but as we're all individuals with different circumstances in our lives I think a blanket ban is a little excessive. Further, we've all done stuff in our lives where we thought we were doing the right thing, only to realise the consequences too late.

To illustrate my point, look at the consequences of the OP and a hypothetical.
The OP is done for being over, loses his license for 6 months, pays a solicitor thousands, pays a large fine and his livelihood is adversely affected. Possible financial cost? In the tens of thousands.


Compare that to a dole bludging recidivist. Gets done for being over. Loses license for a further 6 months, gets legal aid, livelihood not financially affected - even gets a discount on the fine. Possible financial cost? A couple of hundred dollars.

One contributes to society (through taxation) and one takes from society (through welfare).
So of the two who is more likely to learn a very valuable lesson?

I'm not going to condemn the OP without knowing his situation, but I am going to agree that the punishments are manifestly stupid for not measuring the impact they will have on the individual - one who loses much versus one who won't be affected at all.

This person broke a law that is applicable to everyone that uses our roads. As for individual circumstances surrounding why he/she broke that law, Well, That's what the court system is there for, to Hand down any mandatory punishment and to ascertain any leniency that this person maybe afforded due to individual circumstances.

[ltd]

Originally Posted by STEALTHY

If he was just over low range, people might have some sympathy (i wont because you shouldn't be drinking and driving, regardless of the legal limits to avoid this exact situation) but he blew mid range. Thats not 'just a slip', thats well over and getting into plastered territory.

Not my point.
I and I believe the OP were highlighting the disparity in terms of the real affect/s to the offender/s.

[raised by monkeys]

Originally Posted by STEALTHY

If he was just over low range, people might have some sympathy (i wont because you shouldn't be drinking and driving, regardless of the legal limits to avoid this exact situation) but he blew mid range. Thats not 'just a slip', thats well over and getting into plastered territory.

To be fair, .08 isn't exactly plastered territory The limit of .05 you would not consider yourself drunk so I would hardly consider .08 plastered

[arronm]

So your saying be careful if you drive a territory drunk if you are a plasterer ???

[barnz_xr8]

man i blew (on my p plates) .057 BAC = 7 months loss of licence in victoria