Cut down tree's to save lives

[Streets]

armco barriers are as dangerous to motorcyclists as trees are to cars, I wonder if the MAC would want them all pulled out as well?

[jpblue1000]

Originally Posted by Adamz Ghia

And what price do you put on a life...? Is someone on $200,000 a year more important than someone on $45,000 a year.

Irrelevant what they earn, who they are unless they are santa and what they do, unless its deliver presents to me at christmas.
The cost to society to save them from themselves is what's important. And we cant afford it, never could never will.


JP

[aussiblue]

Some of out most beautiful road as so because of the trees. The tourist dollars aside I would hate to loose these. E.g.:

The Karri lined Northcliffe - Shannon and Northcliffe - Pemberton Roads (where I grew up)


Parts of the Great Ocean Road in Victoria:


Lyell Highway in Tassie; nothing like driving under those snow covered gums. The drive through the snow from Lake Pedder to Strahan was a highlight of my holiday in Tassie a few years ago.

[aussiblue]

And just put "tree lined road" into a Google image search to see how the rest of the world celebrates and promotes its tree lined road. We have very few in comparison; perhaps that the problem; too many of us are used to driving in red bulldust in the outback.

[aussiblue]

And look at the low road death rate countries http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ted_death_rate and note that the low death rate Scandinavian countries have snow, ice and many more tree lined roads albeit their trees are softer than ours.

[Itsme]

Problem here in Australia there is lot of people who are in a hurry speeding to their deaths!

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by aussiblue

Some of out most beautiful road as so because of the trees. The tourist dollars aside I would hate to loose these. E.g.:

The Karri lined Northcliffe - Shannon and Northcliffe - Pemberton Roads (where I grew up)
image

Parts of the Great Ocean Road in Victoria:
image

Lyell Highway in Tassie; nothing like driving under those snow covered gums. The drive through the snow from Lake Pedder to Strahan was a highlight of my holiday in Tassie a few years ago.

image

serious, look at the examples you've given.

The first one has around the 5mtr clearance im talking about.

The second one has a similar clearing.

And the third one doesn't look like somewhere you'd be flying along doing 100k's.

Compare that to
This...
http://www.google.com.au/imgres?imgu...CDwQMyg0MDQ4ZA

This
http://www.google.com.au/imgres?imgu...d=0CC0QMygRMBE

This...
http://www.google.com.au/imgres?imgu...d=0CGcQMyhBMEE

And just so you know where im coming from, this...
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/i...eGx_lt6V0lxLYv

And they are just from Google, If I could be bothered taking a drive up there some of the trees in 80-100 zones are lifting the edge of the bitumen with their trunks they are literally growing out of the road.

[Sox]

Sounds like a great idea to me.
Trees and any other immovable object shouldn't be anywhere near the road.

The photos above are fine though, they're not close at all.
Just near my joint there's trees which are perhaps not even 300mm from the road (no shoulder), and there's plenty more examples.
That's just plain dumb to have a tree that close to the road as it leaves absolutely no room for error, and we all make errors from time to time.

I'd reckon at least 2-3m is pretty sensible, depending on the speed limit of course.

Some seem to think that accidents will still happen if the trees are removed. Yes of course they will, however these type of accidents will be reduced, and any accident reduction is a good thing...

[EDManual]

If you hit a tree, bad luck. Drive better.
Sick of this life padding so many whingers want.

Dont cut any down. Put speed limits up next to them. Drive sensibly, no probs.

[mik]

i dont think it would be a bad thing to carefully pick some of the more dangerous trees that actually intrude onto the emergency lane/gravel area,

some of these secondary roads are way over due for widening anyway with the traffic load, so a bit of tree clearing would not be a bad thing in some areas.

[1TUFFUTE]

This whole thing seems a tad silly as before too long well have ALL roads resembling racetracks with gravel traps and all trees and other things gone. It's true. They'll make this change and then it'll progress onto something else, slowly snowballing into oblivion.

It sucks about deaths but cutting millions of trees down seems the wrong path. Maybe more gaurd rails in the dangerous zones??

[Ben73]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

serious, look at the examples you've given.

The first one has around the 5mtr clearance im talking about.

The second one has a similar clearing.

And the third one doesn't look like somewhere you'd be flying along doing 100k's.

Compare that to
This...
http://www.google.com.au/imgres?imgu...CDwQMyg0MDQ4ZA

This
http://www.google.com.au/imgres?imgu...d=0CC0QMygRMBE

This...
http://www.google.com.au/imgres?imgu...d=0CGcQMyhBMEE

And just so you know where im coming from, this...
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/i...eGx_lt6V0lxLYv

And they are just from Google, If I could be bothered taking a drive up there some of the trees in 80-100 zones are lifting the edge of the bitumen with their trunks they are literally growing out of the road.

That first picture is the types of roads I was thinking of too. But where do you draw the line on removing them? I occasionally drive on roads that look like that for 200kms odd with the occasional gap of 100m to a few kms that has no trees next to the road.
In the 200kms I am thinking of there would have to be thousands of trees within 5 metres of the road. It would be a massively impractical job to clear this 200kms let alone roads all over the country.

[aussiblue]

When I grew up in the 50's the Northcliffe - Pemberton Road which was then the main road out of town liked a lot like this with heavy log truck traffic that assumed right of way; it was actually safer to drive at night despite the big grey roos as you could see the lights of the oncoming cars shining on the trees ahead.:


in better parts like this:



We drove accordingly. Yes; people ran into trees but it was mainly city slicker not paying attention. The other risk was in storms and bushfires when Karri could fall across the road; again you drove accordingly or not at all if you could avoid it during fires and storms. I actually miss those old roads although I recognise a two black top is much safer.

[XR Martin]

^You certainly wouldnt fall asleep on those roads...

[1TUFFUTE]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

A suggestion has been made by the MAC to cut down dangerous trees along roadsides in SA to reduce fatalities.
I remember posing this same question when those 6 youngsters in the XR8? ploughed into that tree in Victoria a number of years ago.

Thoughts.

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/s...-1227245474651

Looking at what's been bought up in this thread so far.....I don't think whoever it was that proposed this in the first place thought before they spoke

[irish2]

Originally Posted by trublu

Problem here in Australia there is lot of people who are in a hurry speeding to their deaths!

Out of all the countries I have driven in, this one is by far the slowest.

[pottery beige]

nanny state of affairs

[mik]

Originally Posted by aussiblue

When I grew up in the 50's the Northcliffe - Pemberton Road which was then the main road out of town liked a lot like this with heavy log truck traffic that assumed right of way; it was actually safer to drive at night despite the big grey roos as you could see the lights of the oncoming cars shining on the trees ahead.:
image

in better parts like this:

image

We drove accordingly. Yes; people ran into trees but it was mainly city slicker not paying attention. The other risk was in storms and bushfires when Karri could fall across the road; again you drove accordingly or not at all if you could avoid it during fires and storms. I actually miss those old roads although I recognise a two black top is much safer.

these are not roads i would bother cutting trees down, if dudes are foolish enough to tool around or not be wide awake running these sort of roads , they get no sympathy from this bloke.

[aussiblue]

Today in the UK http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...shes-tree.html and http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-leeds-31787600Tragic and http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news...tragic-5295701 Tragic but you would have to think if the car didn't hit that tree there were other trees and hard objects to hit and it was seemingly speed related. The tree is also fairly well off the road

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by aussiblue

When I grew up in the 50's the Northcliffe - Pemberton Road which was then the main road out of town liked a lot like this with heavy log truck traffic that assumed right of way; it was actually safer to drive at night despite the big grey roos as you could see the lights of the oncoming cars shining on the trees ahead.:
image

in better parts like this:

image

We drove accordingly. Yes; people ran into trees but it was mainly city slicker not paying attention. The other risk was in storms and bushfires when Karri could fall across the road; again you drove accordingly or not at all if you could avoid it during fires and storms. I actually miss those old roads although I recognise a two black top is much safer.

That looks very similar to Cherokee where one of my mates lives:



Mind you the speed limit on those dirt roads is 100km/h, there is one corner going up there which catches first timers by surprise, its off camber and sharper than it looks and if you go into it too hot you end up sideways.

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by aussiblue

Today in the UK http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...shes-tree.html and http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-leeds-31787600Tragic and http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news...tragic-5295701 Tragic but you would have to think if the car didn't hit that tree there were other trees and hard objects to hit and it was seemingly speed related. The tree is also fairly well off the road

Or not, perhaps without those trees there, they would have slid into the shed in the back ground, or stopped before it.

We will never know for sure...

What we do know is that lives have been lost and the tree was involved.

[jpblue1000]

Originally Posted by BENT_8

Or not, perhaps without those trees there, they would have slid into the shed in the back ground, or stopped before it.

We will never know for sure...

What we do know is that lives have been lost and the tree was involved.

A car was also involved, and a driver presumably. Perhaps we start cutting down cars and removing drivers to somewhere near 5 meters from the road. I guarantee no more trees will jump out at the cars then.

JP

[damo76]

Well if people stayed in there lanes and chillax a bit there wouldn't be a problem

[4stanger]

I was amazed how close trees are to the road, when driving in and around the Adelaide Hills and Victor Harbor areas last year, I'm not used to that type of terrain, and cautiously drove to the conditions or kept up with "local" traffic.
These trees would camouflage wild life unpredictably moving out onto the road, my concern is the unknown reaction of drivers coming towards me in this situation, I have to trust their thinking (& reaction) is to stop in their lane, when skippy suddenly jumps out in front of them and Not feel sorry for poor skippy and try to avoid hitting skippy and hitting me head on!
This has happened to me 25 odd years ago when a small wallaby decided to pop out if front of me on a rural tree lined road, so wildlife jumping out if front of vehicles un-announced is possible.
Most of the main roads I have driven on the east coast have a good 5 metre (minimum) buffer zone, from the edge of the road to the start of the tree lined scrub, I believe this set up is the right step towards safer roads.
And also, keep the long grass cut low on main roads.

[The Stylist]

Look at the horrific mess a tree did to a Ford Ranger recently, sadly one deceased.

http://www.avonadvocate.com.au/story...r-fatal-crash/

Sure there are some valid points about drivers being aware of their surroundings and to drive accordingly. But some of the ignorance shown in this thread baffles me - not all situations are fault of the innocent victims.

Being based on the other side of the Tasman as an observer, I've noticed a lot of Australia's roads have trees very close to the tarmac without barriers or banked arresters.

[Xauterus]

I believe that fatigue is far more of a problem than trees on the road. Probably harder to address but far less costly.

[XR Martin]

Originally Posted by The Stylist

Look at the horrific mess a tree did to a Ford Ranger recently, sadly one deceased.

http://www.avonadvocate.com.au/story...r-fatal-crash/

The way that folded up indicates it was travelling waaay too fast.

Probably the safest ute you can buy doesnt end up looking like that unless you're doing 150km+ IMO

[CoupeKing]

Originally Posted by The Stylist

Look at the horrific mess a tree did to a Ford Ranger recently

Tragic I know. But you make it sound like the tree jumped out and attacked the car with battle-axes attached to each branch.

What happens when they start removing the trees, and someone on their phone leaves the road and pancakes the Lumberjacks?

[poppa smurf]

do you see the black stuff in between the tree's?..........stay on that and you'll be okay.

[aussiblue]

That's the York to Youndegin Road. Driven it a few times. Very scenic winding with up and down low hills mostly through open Wheatfields. The blacktop width and quality varies a lot and in places it is very narrow and rough. Mostly 110 kph limit but 80 kmh in places and lots of yellow crest and winding road cautions signs. There are a few places on that road where I think the speed limit should be 70 or 80 rather than 110 but I could say that about a lot of WA country backroads - and in the old days they were open speed limit areas. Unfortunately a lot of drivers feel obliged to drive at the speed limit or more where the sign says 110 despite the road conditions and following traffic can put the pressure on not to hold them up. Lots of farm machinery and associated truck on the road according to the season (harvesting, seeding etc).

Edit: I just cyber drove that section where the accident happened on Google Earth and it part of the road where it is very narrow with soft edges and the limit is 110. You can see how someone might have taken a bend at 100 or more and a wheel slipped into the soft edge so they lost control. Especially if they encountered a semi with a load of stock coming the other way.