Porsche questions GT-R Ring claim

[4Vman]

Seriously.. if i was Porsche why would you even bother questioning the time... why do they even care? look which brand has the runs on the board and credibility....

[Wally]

http://www.garage419.com/episode/419_20080710

[Ives]

Ok now, if Nissan and Porsche approach YOU with a sponsor-ship offer... and the car that you will be driving is the GT-R or the 911 Turbo... which company would you sign with?

Personally I would have a hard time choosing.

[irlewy86]

Personally... Porsche.

Because that way I'd be a shoe in for a job on Top Gear Australia despite being an annoying knob!

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by Ives

Ok now, if Nissan and Porsche approach YOU with a sponsor-ship offer... and the car that you will be driving is the GT-R or the 911 Turbo... which company would you sign with?

Personally I would have a hard time choosing.

The one with the best track record for pace, reliability and race success....

Its one thing to have a one lap wonder, but it takes allot more to keep it together over a race.

"To finish first first you have to finish..."

[Fireblade]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

The one with the best track record for pace, reliability and race success....

Its one thing to have a one lap wonder, but it takes allot more to keep it together over a race.

"To finish first first you have to finish..."

I think you will both have tremendous track pedigrees, in my case too hard to answer so I'll just take both thanks..... :

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by GR8WITE

I think you will both have tremendous track pedigrees, in my case too hard to answer so I'll just take both thanks..... :

Track pedigree, Nissan V Porsche..???? doesnt seem like a fair comparrison does it.... unless you like playstation and drifting....

[geckoGT]

Personally I think both would be capable of giving a very interesting multi lap race and I have no doubt that the GT-R would last long enough to be considered more than a 1 lap wonder. It is not like nissan do not have any race experience, anyone remembe Godzilla or the datsun 1600 that dominated world rally and made every other manufacturer stand up and take notice.

I am sure the development team that worked on a venture as large as GT-R contained more than a few people with a bit of an idea on how to build a high powered, high performance weapon. Especially when their design brief was to build something that would stick it to the traditional european supercar manufacturers.

[ehast13]

I'll have to dig up a few of my car mags from the past 12 months because ... at the time when Nissan was bragging about laptimes it was noted by more than one magazine that the cars being whipped out on the track were wearing semi- slick tyres.

One motor noter commented that nissan wouldn't let them drive the gtr on those tyres when it rained. They made them use the raod tyres. When Nissan PR gurus where questioned they claimed that the semi slick race tyres made no difference to the lap time but that they were available and more consistent than either of the production tyre choices to be offered.

A swedish (correct me if I am wrong) scribe reckoned the semi slick tyres made a 25-30sec difference at the Nurburgring on a M3 he had driven.

I wonder if the GTR hype is getting a bit out of hand?

By all accounts, the GTR is a brilliant car but it is heavy and with a higher (by as much as 21 cm according to some ) centre of gravity. I would expect it to lap very quickly but surely not as consistently as the porsche (imagine the front tyre wear on the 1700kg front engine GTR).

Realistically, a 7.29 does seem a bit hard to swallow on 'road tyres'. Nissan tried this a few years ago with a claim that the GTR was the first road car to dip below 8mins. It was later revealed that it was done on some pretty special rubber.

Porsche are usually pretty conservative with their claims and take great pride in using road production road tyres for accelaration and track times. A few years ago the carrera gt was tested against an Enzo and was 2sec a lap quicker around Monza. Porsche said little.

All being said and done, my money would be on the porsche to be quicker in experienced hands but the GTR quicker with a novice like me driving. I reckon the GTR would do well over a single lap but the Deutschemidlifekrisiswagen to be more consistent.

Hot Lap? GT2, GT3, nissan GTR, porsche Turbo, carrera s, etc in that order

This is one time when I couldn't care less If I'm wrong or right. I'd love a hot lap in any of them. Hell, I'd hot lap a Nissan Micra at the ring! I'd even pay to do it.

Just a thought. . . Jim Richards testing GTR vs Porsche Turbo. You gotta admit, he's a won a few things in both cars!

[GT-E]

You cannot get 20" slicks for a GTR, or all the people running them in tarmac events would be using them.

[ehast13]

semi slick. This term can be applied to a wide variety of soft compound tyres with many types of light or varied tread patterns. Just repeatin' what I read. Seems odd no-one makes a 'slick' tyre for the best performance vehicle since Noah hooked the ark up to a marlin.

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Track pedigree, Nissan V Porsche..???? doesnt seem like a fair comparrison does it.... unless you like playstation and drifting....

Pedigree ah yes track pedigree familiar in your posts.

If i had the money id find it hard to choose which car id buy, pedigree would have nothing to do with it what so ever. But id be leaning towards the GT-R as id prefer something a little different

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by geckoGT

Personally I think both would be capable of giving a very interesting multi lap race and I have no doubt that the GT-R would last long enough to be considered more than a 1 lap wonder. It is not like nissan do not have any race experience, anyone remembe Godzilla or the datsun 1600 that dominated world rally and made every other manufacturer stand up and take notice.

I am sure the development team that worked on a venture as large as GT-R contained more than a few people with a bit of an idea on how to build a high powered, high performance weapon. Especially when their design brief was to build something that would stick it to the traditional european supercar manufacturers.

Ditto

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by ZapXR6T

You cannot get 20" slicks for a GTR, or all the people running them in tarmac events would be using them.

Don't you think Nissan could get their supplier to make them whatever they wanted? Wouldn't be hard for them to ask Bridgestone to change the compound specifically for them to test.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by ZC001

Sooks.
Just bitter about losing the war.
Twice

Japan lost the war too.

[Quicksand]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Seriously.. if i was Porsche why would you even bother questioning the time... why do they even care? look which brand has the runs on the board and credibility....

THIS is what stands out for me and i tend to agree. It is interesting that PORSCHE mentioned that they are using NISSAN as their benchmark. Who would have thought they would see the day when this scenario would happen?

Personally i think Nissan should give themselves a massive pat on the back for even being considered by Porsche as a benchmark (no offence intended to Nissan or Nissan fans)

[irlewy86]

Originally Posted by Inducted_Breeze

THIS is what stands out for me and i tend to agree. It is interesting that PORSCHE mentioned that they are using NISSAN as their benchmark. Who would have thought they would see the day when this scenario would happen?

Personally i think Nissan should give themselves a massive pat on the back for even being considered by Porsche as a benchmark (no offence intended to Nissan or Nissan fans)

They said they were going to over a year ago when Nissan came out and said they would own the ring. Thats Porsche for ya, they aren't concerned about who the competitor is, they just want to make their product the best it can be.

Which is probably why they are so pevved at not being able to punt the GTR around the track at 7:29. Nissan has them chasing a ghost and needs to fess up with whats going on.

[BlackLS]

Originally Posted by 51RTE

Pedigree ah yes track pedigree familiar in your posts.

If i had the money id find it hard to choose which car id buy, pedigree would have nothing to do with it what so ever. But id be leaning towards the GT-R as id prefer something a little different

Ditto.
Except I'd go straight for the GT-R no question. Nissan has relevant track pedigree in Australia. They've won Bathurst. Twice.

Those who would chooses Porches over the Nissan are probably just brand snobs.

[austyphoon]

http://www.drive.com.au/Editorial/Ar...ID=57410&vf=12


I believe you can actually go look at the GT-R that ran that time, it's in some showroom in Japan.













Funny how this bombshell was dropped at Porsche's announcement of it's Aus pricing for the 2009 911 and a day before Nissan's GT-R pricing for Australia.

[Homer1]

Originally Posted by ThePistonHead

http://carsguide.news.com.au/site/mo...referrer=email

They accuse the GTR of using semi-slicks when they use the Michelin Pilot Sport Cup, also a semi-slick track tyre in their own test? The GTR design would have been optimized for the RE070s, not the Pilot Sport Cups anyway.

[PoMmYwOG]

Originally Posted by BlackLS

Those who would chooses Porches over the Nissan are probably just brand snobs.

Cmon mate thats an unfair statement. To me its down to personal preference, nothing to do with the brand. I personally like the GT2 over the GTR.

[bdave351]

Originally Posted by BlackLS

Those who would chooses Porches over the Nissan are probably just brand snobs.

Hmmm by that standard I would say that people who choose Nissan over Porches are just expensive ricers!

[Ives]

The Bridgestone Potenza RE070R are NOT semi-slick tyres. They are ultra-high performance road tyres. I don't know why people have difficulty understanding that.



SEMI SLICK TYRES








ROAD TYRES

[tranquilized]

Originally Posted by Ives

There's another thing you have to take into consideration. The Nurburging is open for public, people can pay 15-20 Euros and do a lap. If you look at the GT-R video, it looks like a clean run, no traffic. Nissan might do that run early early in the morning OR blocked off the track for 8 minutes.

I read that Porsche never arrange for the track to be blocked off, so the times the 911 Turbo pulled can definitely be improved.

The Nurburgring is only open to the public about 50% of the time, maybe less - "The Ring is not open to the public all the time - it's used for all sorts of other things, like manufacturer test sessions, training schools, private hire days, etc. Indeed, the Ring is generally only open to the public on weekday evenings, a handful of weekends and the odd half-day here and there." http://nurburgring.org.uk/

Not sure where you read Porsche never book the track but I'm sure its not true, theres no way they'd be testing the Panamera among public novices. Both the Porsche and Nissan lap time claims would have been made on a closed track. Theres some unbelievably slow traffic on the track when its open to the public - ie tourbuses! Fast times are difficult to achieve by anyone in anycar during those times.

As for the choice between a Porsche or GTR... Porsche all the way! A Porsche doesn't use it's sat nav to watch where and how you drive the car in order to question warranty claims, and you wont have to rebuild the engine every 100,000km's in a Porsche.

[Bad Bird]

Originally Posted by Ives

The Bridgestone Potenza RE070R are NOT semi-slick tyres. They are ultra-high performance road tyres. I don't know why people have difficulty

Because the GTR's Potenzas are NOT off-the-shelf items. They are specific to the GTR, despite what the name suggests. Go do some research on some tech boards, such as Corner-Carvers.com.