Buying a small 4 cyl buzzbox to save fuel?

[stevz]

Just goes to show what a misconception that is.....

Question

I have just bought a Kia Cerato and have been amazed to find I am getting on average 10 litres per 100 kilometres. I have approached Kia, who have directed me to look at ADR81/02 or ECE101, which still does not tell me anything. I would like to know whether this is normal for a four-cylinder car, as I have been achieving an average of 9.5L/100km with my Holden Berlina.

Ian

Answer ...........

http://theage.drive.com.au/motor-new...110-2cj4r.html

[Bucknaked]

Originally Posted by stevz

Just goes to show what a misconception that is.....


http://theage.drive.com.au/motor-new...110-2cj4r.html

Maybe the drivers habits on the road contributes to the higher consumption. I agree with the misconception. Some people think by getting a small 4 banger, you can drive it race car and still get 5 litres for 100.

[Smoke Pursuit]

Yeah but whats an XR6 around town? 14.6....

Its all relative.

500 kms urban in an XR6 at 14.6 l/h = 73 litres. 73 litres at 1.45 = $106
500 kms urban in a Kia at 10.4 l/h = 52 litres at 1.45 = $75

so for every 500 kms you save $31... or every 1000 $62... Say you do 10,000 kms a year that's $620

The whole idea of buying a small car shouldn't be attributed by fuel savings alone... There's other factors like less depreciation (dollar value not necessarily %), cheaper rego, cheaper tyres (as most smaller cars still run smaller tyres), cheaper insurance etc etc.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by DASH GT

Yeah but whats an XR6 around town? 14.6....

Its all relative.

500 kms urban in an XR6 at 14.6 l/h = 73 litres. 73 litres at 1.45 = $106
500 kms urban in a Kia at 10.4 l/h = 52 litres at 1.45 = $75

so for every 500 kms you save $31... or every 1000 $62... Say you do 10,000 kms a year that's $620

My wife drives 80km per day to/from work. I sold our BA2 XT and bought a Hyundai Getz which saves about $30 per week or about $1200 per year which after adding the saving of $200 in rego and 5 years of warranty (3 to go) paid for itself completely after 9 months......

[Stagg]

"Stagg why do you own a V8?! they cost the earth to run and make more pollution than my Corolla"

"I know they do, hence I drive it once every few weeks and ride a 250cc motorbike every day. Why do you drive a Corolla every day when it produces more pollution than my motorbike, and even though my car is a V8 there is still more pollution coming form your car, on a count of driving it every day?"


This argument I face every day... first world problems lol

[mike_nofx]

Originally Posted by flappist

My wife drives 80km per day to/from work. I sold our BA2 XT and bought a Hyundai Getz which saves about $30 per week or about $1200 per year which after adding the saving of $200 in rego and 5 years of warranty (3 to go) paid for itself completely after 9 months......

I don't get it, what paid for itself completely in 9 months?

[stevz]

Originally Posted by flappist

My wife drives 80km per day to/from work. I sold our BA2 XT and bought a Hyundai Getz which saves about $30 per week or about $1200 per year which after adding the saving of $200 in rego and 5 years of warranty (3 to go) paid for itself completely after 9 months......

When I read of instances like this, I feel compelled to ask the question - what dollar value do you put on a life? You sold a perfectly good (and safe) BA and replaced it with one of the worst death traps of recent times... to save a paltry $1400 per year?
I'm sorry but I have never understood that logic - and never will.

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by DASH GT

Yeah but whats an XR6 around town? 14.6....

Its all relative.

SO my GT335 driven 90% around town (not freeways) is sitting at 14.7/100 ..... so either it is bloody brilliant or a drive like a girl!

[Smoke Pursuit]

Originally Posted by Auslandau

SO my GT335 driven 90% around town (not freeways) is sitting at 14.7/100 ..... so either it is bloody brilliant or a drive like a girl!

Drove my friends SC GT 5.0 last night which had done 95% freeway since the last reset and it was sitting on 15.1... hardly worth comparing really considering we all drive differently, on different roads, at different times of the day.

My comparison was for comparison sake only, not gospel, based on ADR figures.

And yes you probably do drive like an old woman or have one of those Brock Polarisers fitted, don't you just...

[Smoke Pursuit]

Originally Posted by stevz

When I read of instances like this, I feel compelled to ask the question - what dollar value do you put on a life? You sold a perfectly good (and safe) BA and replaced it with one of the worst death traps of recent times... to save a paltry $1400 per year?
I'm sorry but I have never understood that logic - and never will.

Yes... but that 10 year old BA XT could break down on the highway causing a bdouble to run over the top of you.... When your times up, its up!

[SSD-85]

*sigh* this is why I love driving my cars to solely enjoy them. Not to worry about many microfarts extra fuel I burn when I think about stamping the loud pedal 1/10th of a second faster...

[grandpa_spec_F6]

Depending on who is driving my car its as fuel effecient as a kia or inefficient as an fa18... and usually sounds like one on full boost!

If youre worried about money dont buy a fuel guzzler... for the rest of us who dont even look at the pump price, thats our decision on how we spend our money... kindly take your co2 and cram it.

[STINKY NINJA]

If its a 4cyl it has to be manual or the economy will be not awesome,our old manual 2010 lancer got around high 6 to low 7 per hundred all city driving and was manual,autos were higher fuel consumption than that and slower too,it used to get driven pretty hard when i was behind the wheel,only issue was the front tyres wore out way too quick...

[jpblue1000]

Originally Posted by stevz

When I read of instances like this, I feel compelled to ask the question - what dollar value do you put on a life? You sold a perfectly good (and safe) BA and replaced it with one of the worst death traps of recent times... to save a paltry $1400 per year?
I'm sorry but I have never understood that logic - and never will.

in a US study 'AN ANALYSIS OF TRAFFIC DEATHS BY VEHICLE TYPE AND MODEL' conducted by Marc Ross, University of Michigan, Physics Department Tom Wenzel, Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory published in 2002 they declare:
"In any event, the argument that the low weight of cars with high fuel economy has resulted in many excess deaths is unfounded; that by paying careful attention to safety in vehicle design, smaller cars can be, and indeed have been, made as safe as larger ones"
In fact their statistics go on to suggest that you are more likely to die 'statistically' in a performance model than you are in a 'buzbox' following with "Import luxury cars have the lowest combined risk, while
sports cars have the highest combined risk"
I put it too you that an XR6/8 is statistically more likely to kill than a corolla. and you wont have enough money to pay for a funeral due to the higher annual fuel bill.
JP

[grandpa_spec_F6]

Jc, I remember reading somewhere that smart cars survive high speed impacts very well... but the geforces the occupants experience dont. They stated a larger car didnt fair any better, wish I could find the link!

[stevz]

Originally Posted by jpblue1000

in a US study 'AN ANALYSIS OF TRAFFIC DEATHS BY VEHICLE TYPE AND MODEL' conducted by Marc Ross, University of Michigan, Physics Department Tom Wenzel, Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory published in 2002 they declare:
"In any event, the argument that the low weight of cars with high fuel economy has resulted in many excess deaths is unfounded; that by paying careful attention to safety in vehicle design, smaller cars can be, and indeed have been, made as safe as larger ones"
In fact their statistics go on to suggest that you are more likely to die 'statistically' in a performance model than you are in a 'buzbox' following with "Import luxury cars have the lowest combined risk, while
sports cars have the highest combined risk"
I put it too you that an XR6/8 is statistically more likely to kill than a corolla. and you wont have enough money to pay for a funeral due to the higher annual fuel bill.
JP

Yes, performance vehicles are overrepresented in the road toll due to the manner they are driven in (high speeds, risk taking etc) but that is completely irrelevant to the discussion in this thread.

If you were driving down the highway obeying the speed limit and minding your own business and a car coming the other way suddenly veered into your path and collided with you head on, do you seriously think you would be better of in a Getz than a BA? You don't have to be a crash safety engineer to see that the difference between a BA Falcon and a Getz is coming out with non life threatening injuries, and being carried away in a bag.

I'm not denying that safety of small cars has improved significantly in recent years, but the Getz is a number of generations old and does not fall into this category.

[jmack]

sometime its not just yhe fuel usage,what is the change over value in purchasing a new small car when they give bugger all tradein ,this extra money especialy if it is financed has to be taken into account as well,a bigger car that u own that uses a little fuel could well end up cheaper than a new car with payments,dosnt matter which pocket the money comes out of its still gone,and besides who wants there knees stuck under their chin and and having to send an invitation out to the speedo to move specialy when u turn the air con on in a 4 cyl

[jpblue1000]

Originally Posted by stevz

If you were driving down the highway obeying the speed limit and minding your own business and a car coming the other way suddenly veered into your path and collided with you head on, do you seriously think you would be better of in a Getz than a BA? You don't have to be a crash safety engineer to see that the difference between a BA Falcon and a Getz is coming out with non life threatening injuries, and being carried away in a bag.

I don't disagree, Id prefer to be in the BA too, hence the word statistically used in my post. As you know there are many varying factors involved in a comparing incidents leading to fatalities, from driver demographic to dynamic abilities. But 'statistically', when all factors have been weighted and balanced 'statistically' there is little benefit to car size as proven in the study. Therefore in my mind the argumant of placing a cost of a life in the argument about fuel economy is flawed. 'Statistically' you are equally likely to die in a falcon as a getz, however with a getz you saved a shed load of cash along the way. (I will ignore the social issues pertaining to driving a Hyundai for now)

JP

[flappist]

Originally Posted by mike_nofx

I don't get it, what paid for itself completely in 9 months?

The brand new Getz with 5 years warranty was just over $10k.
I sold the BA2 for $9k.
So with $200 less rego plus $30/wk for 30 weeks it was cash neutral, as in "paid for itself".

[flappist]

Originally Posted by stevz

Yes, performance vehicles are overrepresented in the road toll due to the manner they are driven in (high speeds, risk taking etc) but that is completely irrelevant to the discussion in this thread.

If you were driving down the highway obeying the speed limit and minding your own business and a car coming the other way suddenly veered into your path and collided with you head on, do you seriously think you would be better of in a Getz than a BA? You don't have to be a crash safety engineer to see that the difference between a BA Falcon and a Getz is coming out with non life threatening injuries, and being carried away in a bag.

I'm not denying that safety of small cars has improved significantly in recent years, but the Getz is a number of generations old and does not fall into this category.

Really?

A 2010 Getz is generations old while a 2004 BA2 is current technology?

Please make sure you don't let sense or logic get in the way of your argument......

[stevz]

Originally Posted by flappist

Really?

A 2010 Getz is generations old while a 2004 BA2 is current technology?

Please make sure you don't let sense or logic get in the way of your argument......

The 2010 Getz dates back to around 2001-02 with nothing more than a few cosmetic updates. It's basic design is older than the hills.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by stevz

The 2010 Getz dates back to around 2001-02 with nothing more than a few cosmetic updates.

You mean like the BA dates back to 1998.......

[XRGhia]

I'll keep my modified falcon and drive it every day... I'm getting ~8.5L/100km's in my wagon, and it doesn't get driven soft either.

Sometimes "medium sized" or "large" cars can get just as good, if not better fuel economy then a 4 or 3 banger...

[Yellow_Festiva]

I can slightly better, match or add 30% to the factory consumption figures of any car I have owned. Depends on how they are driven.

[XR Martin]

Kia have gotten into big trouble in the US from fudging economy figures....

After receiving a number of complaints from drivers, the Environmental Protection Agency went back and investigated the fuel-economy claims of various Hyundai and Kia models. EPA tests showed that the actual mileage often fell short of what was advertised, usually by one or two miles per gallon—but in one case by as much as six miles per gallon.

Hyundai and Kia said they would not contest the EPA’s finding and will compensate about 900,000 customers who have bought cars with misleading mileage stickers, a cost that could run to hundreds of millions of dollars. The companies, which are both owned by Hyundai Motor Group, said that the errors were unintentional.

In recent years, Hyundai and Kia have been making major inroads into the U.S. market with their popular lines of small cars such as the Hyundai Elantra and Kia Rio, both of which have been marketed as getting 40 miles per gallon on the highway.

But those claims will now take a big hit—as could, potentially, the reputations of both companies. The latest models of the Hyundai Elantra, Accent, and Veloster, as well as the Kia Rio, will no longer be able to claim 40 miles per gallon on the highway. The EPA will redo the mileage stickers for most of the companies’ 2012 and 2013 models, knocking Hyundai’s average fuel economy in 2012 down from 27 miles per gallon to 26 miles per gallon.

[Bearman]

Originally Posted by Auslandau

SO my GT335 driven 90% around town (not freeways) is sitting at 14.7/100 ..... so either it is bloody brilliant or a drive like a girl!

That's unreal!! I never got much better than that in the 180,000km I drove in my old BA XR6 with very similar driving conditions. I was never happy with its fuel economy. The AU XR6 I had before it was better on the juice.

My current daily driver egg beater is noticeably cheaper to run than the BA despite having to run premium fuel.

[mike_nofx]

Originally Posted by DASH GT

Yeah but whats an XR6 around town? 14.6....

Its all relative.

500 kms urban in an XR6 at 14.6 l/h = 73 litres. 73 litres at 1.45 = $106
500 kms urban in a Kia at 10.4 l/h = 52 litres at 1.45 = $75

so for every 500 kms you save $31... or every 1000 $62... Say you do 10,000 kms a year that's $620

The whole idea of buying a small car shouldn't be attributed by fuel savings alone... There's other factors like less depreciation (dollar value not necessarily %), cheaper rego, cheaper tyres (as most smaller cars still run smaller tyres), cheaper insurance etc etc.

My BF egas does basically same as your XR6: 14.6L/100km. That's a mix of highway and around town. So with LPG at 75c (and I ALWAYS have an 8c off voucher so really 67c but i wont subtract that for the purpose of this exercise) for 500km it costs me $54.75. (Using voucher it's $48.91)

Insurance is cheap in a Falcon wagon, tyres are cheap 16", one of the cheapest cars on earth to service, I really can't complain.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by mike_nofx

My BF egas does basically same as your XR6: 14.6L/100km. That's a mix of highway and around town. So with LPG at 75c (and I ALWAYS have an 8c off voucher so really 67c but i wont subtract that for the purpose of this exercise) for 500km it costs me $54.75. (Using voucher it's $48.91)

Insurance is cheap in a Falcon wagon, tyres are cheap 16", one of the cheapest cars on earth to service, I really can't complain.

Costs me about $80 for 1000km in my TDCI Focus, which is nearly 2 weeks worth of driving to and from work.

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by stevz

The BA was such a comprehensive rework of the 1998 AU that it could almost be considered an all new car.
.... etc

OK .... everyone has had their say on the benefits of large/small cars vs a truck .... all been said in other threads and as you can see (and titled yourself) is to do with Buying a small 4 cyl buzzbox to save fuel so leave it at that and move onto the actual topic at hand?


Thanks ........

[Franco Cozzo]

I can't wait when my Falcon is on the road so I can drive it to and from work for a week to test out its fuel economy as I mainly do all highway.

Focus says my average speed is around 60km/h over a tank, when I drove it home I had the Falcon showing around 8L/100km on its fuel readout, but now its worked, so thats probably gone out the window.