D is for DON'T GET CAUGHT

[Interceptor]

Originally Posted by Barry_v

dont presume to know anything about me.

Im sure Im not the only one who watches television or goes to the movies to escape reality.. not to be reminded of it.



so you have seen the results in person and you still act in this manner. what hope does a TV ad have?

i suggest you take your own words and not presume so much about me..... i'd say i've probably slowed down a fair bit in the last year, still get up to the occasional bit of lunacy, but not as bad as i used to be

[Firefox7]

Some of those video's are pretty shocking.....Glad I do all my speeding on the circuit these days.


Cheers

[blur1]

Originally Posted by Fordmuscle1965

This article in the sunday mail I read it, all associated pictures with the story(8 of them) were of Holden commodores. Does this mean if you own a dunnydore you are basically fodder for the hoon laws? :togo:

another clip of sammy running 3.81 secs 1/4 mile.
http://videos.streetfire.net/video/ceea7138-5a48-4bdd-bb74-98540077563b.htm"

i tried to click it, but it didnt work.

[kooky]

Originally Posted by Nikk O'lass

Yeah, the need to show wreks of cars and stuff....


Example:
(Flash backs of 4 mates hooning around, laughing, driver does a handbrakie...
...show pictures of a car wrapped around a tree or pole of some sort, blood body on ground)

driver:20
Car: WRX
200kmh, 4 mates, one mistake...

now he has 3 less mates...

...his new wheels are on a chair.

And to top it off, he can't be a lover no more.

Dont be a ********.

(closing pictures of his girlfriend walking out...)

(blank out word is a more direct form of this: Richard Cranium)

You dont have to own a WRX to be a ********* :

[sgt_doofey]

Originally Posted by sexr6tasy

I agree with you mate i live in adelaide and its a **** hole but the reason theres no speed signs is because our government always pedals the crap its 50kmhs UNLESS otherwise signed eg. if theres no speed signs you always drive at 50kmh.

The rule is 50km/h unless otherwise signposted in a built up area.

[Nikked]

Originally Posted by kooky

You dont have to own a WRX to be a ********* :

yeah i know, not singling out WRX drivers for being *********, just using a popular car.

Hope i haven't offened you.

[Fordmuscle1965]

Originally Posted by blur1

i tried to click it, but it didnt work.

you need to copy and paste it in the address area. :

[eldreamin]

Originally Posted by Green X

what have the Hoon laws really achieved.

I can answer that. What they have achieved is a means for cops to book anyone they feel like whether they do something wrong on purpose, sneeze, make an honest mistake or anything they automatically decide that you are wrong and therefore need to be punished.

As for what needs to be done, driver training, teaching people the results of their actions and more places off the street for those who do feel the need to be a hero.

Cheers
Jase.

P.S. I recently had highway patrol fine me for something I didnt do so was not impressed at all. :(

[sexr6tasy]

Id say the city is a built up area

Originally Posted by sgt_doofey

The rule is 50km/h unless otherwise signposted in a built up area.

[Jayden]

note to self: dont drive a camry sideways into a powerpole at 160kmph

[Beetus]

Originally Posted by Interceptor

you think thats horrible? what about the ones who have to live with the real life consequences of other peoples stupidity? the physical disabilities, missing friends, the nightmares, not being able to travel a stretch of road again without knowing what happened, the flashbacks, etc?

maybe when you've either been in a car crash or witnessed the first hand, on scene damage caused by someones stupidity and recklessness, then maybe you'll understand

god knows, i've done some stupid **** in my life, i've raced, i've done burnouts, broken the speed limit on barely suitable roads, etc, and i know it was wrong, even though i minimised the risk to others the best i could (i try to avoid stupid **** with others in the car, and yes, i know that wont help people on the street or other cars)

i've also watched 2 people go from having a good day, to one dying in the wreck and the other dying in intensive care a few days later, i watched the car hit the pole, i saw the passenger twitching in her seat, i saw the blood, and i heard the screams.... i can still see and hear it all now, anytime, anywhere

i dont know about you, but i'd sooner see a TV ad like that than have to live through it again

dont look if youre squeamish, its the result of a camry at 160+ sideways into a power pole
http://www.fordforums.com.au/attachm...chmentid=23147

amen to that..... been through the same thing, you never forget...... i reckon that add is awesome and should be out on tv asap, ive only had my p's 18 months and after seeing what i saw... it changed the way i drive massively.....

[xy351]

instead of putting so much money into graphic television commercials, how about putting some money into local facilities where car enthusiasts can enjoy their cars and their capabilities. for alot of people their cars are a hobby and a passion... but these people are being stopped from enjoying them. i think that a facility where people can enjoy there hobby legally will greatly decrease the amount of 'hoons' on the road...

[Sourbastard]

You want a lower road toll? You want less hoons? Create a harder licensing testing system including a psychological test. Those who qualify get a license, those that dont walk. Those who drive unlicensed and get caught spend time in the Brig.

you can stick the 1000 dollar per second advertising campaign as its pointless.

Not giving idiots a license in the first place is far better then watching kids being disembowled during Roves mindless dribble.

As for our recent laws being abused by those who enforce them, of course those rules are there to be abused. Zero Tolerance is the direction from South Australias policy makers to ensure they get the right amount of votes from the brainless Zombies who watch Today Tonight. They have written the laws in such a way to ensure there is as much legal & operational lattitude as possible for those who enforce them, and many Police use & abuse this lattitude. I have noticed in this state though a modifying influence emerging. The english policemen & women being brought into SAPOL are some of the best police I have seen. They are polite, courteous, fair & seem to have excellent skills in dealing with the public. Far better training it seems & no super hero complex.

[Beetus]

Originally Posted by sourbastard

You want a lower road toll? You want less hoons? Create a harder licensing testing system including a psychological test. Those who qualify get a license, those that dont walk. Those who drive unlicensed and get caught spend time in the Brig.

you can stick the 1000 dollar per second advertising campaign as its pointless.

Not giving idiots a license in the first place is far better then watching kids being disembowled during Roves mindless dribble.

As for our recent laws being abused by those who enforce them, of course those rules are there to be abused. Zero Tolerance is the direction from South Australias policy makers to ensure they get the right amount of votes from the brainless Zombies who watch Today Tonight. They have written the laws in such a way to ensure there is as much legal & operational lattitude as possible for those who enforce them, and many Police use & abuse this lattitude. I have noticed in this state though a modifying influence emerging. The english policemen & women being brought into SAPOL are some of the best police I have seen. They are polite, courteous, fair & seem to have excellent skills in dealing with the public. Far better training it seems & no super hero complex.

How is the licencing centre sposed to know if the person going for there licence is a idiot or not? Rules arent there to be abused they are there to be followed, like the rest of us. There is no one step fix for the situation........there will be ********* no matter what they are driving and whatever rules are in place, making it harder to get a licence will just encourage more driving without licence, i know from what i see, ppl have to get round and they always do it with a bike, walking or public transport. Try having a solution for everyone...........which there isnt

[Sourbastard]

Originally Posted by Beetus

How is the licencing centre sposed to know if the person going for there licence is a idiot or not? Rules arent there to be abused they are there to be followed, like the rest of us. There is no one step fix for the situation........there will be ********* no matter what they are driving and whatever rules are in place, making it harder to get a licence will just encourage more driving without licence, i know from what i see, ppl have to get round and they always do it with a bike, walking or public transport. Try having a solution for everyone...........which there isnt

I see your point of view.

However.

Stronger testing and a Psyche test would easily weed out alot who should never have a license in the first place. Our licensing system in this country is a joke compared to European Systems. Where are the thousands of unlicensed drivers dying there?

of course there is no single fix, but a better licensing & driver education system is the first step in any road safety fix. If it doesnt occur, everything after it is just wasted effort.

[Riksta]

Originally Posted by eldreamin

P.S. I recently had highway patrol fine me for something I didnt do so was not impressed at all. :(

What didn't you do? :P

Sorry, couldn't help myself.

[Beetus]

Originally Posted by sourbastard

I see your point of view.

However.

Stronger testing and a Psyche test would easily weed out alot who should never have a license in the first place. Our licensing system in this country is a joke compared to European Systems. Where are the thousands of unlicensed drivers dying there?

of course there is no single fix, but a better licensing & driver education system is the first step in any road safety fix. If it doesnt occur, everything after it is just wasted effort.

Yep your spot on! but the european car scene is unlike australia, it is sorta a culture part of society here. All the burnout comps and revheads motorvation shows everywhere if your following me there. a pscyc test sound like a idea but surely ppl could fool that?

[5L]

its a bit wrong they use the same pictures from ragerz commodore club from over 2 years ago. is the sunday mail turning as bad as today tonight. i mean for those who seen the drifters in the adelaide hills from last week, they had a "professional" say how they dont know how to drive and how they had no control over the car. If you ask me they were bloody good drivers, sure they shouldnt be doing it on the public roads and yes in adelaide we have a racetrack where they can drift on.

[Sourbastard]

Originally Posted by Beetus

Yep your spot on! but the european car scene is unlike australia, it is sorta a culture part of society here. All the burnout comps and revheads motorvation shows everywhere if your following me there. a pscyc test sound like a idea but surely ppl could fool that?

actually its quite hard, as most of the questions arent directly related to the subject. They work on the basis of assembling a psych profile of general behaviour and tendencies rather then "what would you do if this bloke pulls infront of you". Its hard to fool a test when then questions are of a huge variety on many differeing subjects and situations.

[Tuddy200]

So my children or any children for that matter should be subject to these stupid and disgusting ads like the smoking ones that seem to come on when i'm trying to eat my lunch, what about them? They don't smoke, I don't smoke. Do they deserve to see the bloody ads of stupid drivers when they are not even old enough to know what a car can do? You can't play M/MA movies before a certain time, but you can play these ads, wake up Australia! :

If you want steps to reduece the Road Toll, I suggest the goverment get some balls about itself and ask other places how there laws are set-up and how there licensing system is.

I think the police need an attidude adjustment as well, the amount of them I see using a mobile while driving, or tinted windows x10 times darker then were allowed, there constant speeding down the main road (not excessive, but at least 5-10kms over). What happened to lead by example?

1. Tougher Licensing (like sourbastard said)
2. Tougher laws on 'unlicensed' drivers. (6-12months min)
3. More places to legally engage in your hobby - For those that it is a hobby/interest and not a way to show to other motorists on the streets.
4. Simply more police presence on our roads, and not hiding behind a tree with a speed radar so we can't see them.

I don't see how it is only the hoons being targeted here either, what about the countless number of 'oldies' that have come close to wiping me out? Mothers doing 60 through there childs school zone, or the couier driver that cut me off in there vans cause they think there bigger and better?

Truck drivers are some of the best here in Victoria, if i'm looking o overtake them, they indicate when the road is clear for me (of course i still do my own check but...), if they are coming behind me, i let them through and they say thank you, more then what i can say for the interstate drivers who come flying up behind you, sit on your ****, just so they can reach the boarder by 12PM.

Hoon laws are not culling the road toll, it's simply giving us 18-21 year olds something to challange!!

[prydey]

Originally Posted by sexr6tasy

Id say the city is a built up area

we're talking adelaide here!! not sure it qualifies as a built up area.

[Beetus]

Originally Posted by G.J.Tuddy

So my children or any children for that matter should be subject to these stupid and disgusting ads like the smoking ones that seem to come on when i'm trying to eat my lunch, what about them? They don't smoke, I don't smoke. Do they deserve to see the bloody ads of stupid drivers when they are not even old enough to know what a car can do? You can't play M/MA movies before a certain time, but you can play these ads, wake up Australia! :

If you want steps to reduece the Road Toll, I suggest the goverment get some balls about itself and ask other places how there laws are set-up and how there licensing system is.

I think the police need an attidude adjustment as well, the amount of them I see using a mobile while driving, or tinted windows x10 times darker then were allowed, there constant speeding down the main road (not excessive, but at least 5-10kms over). What happened to lead by example?

1. Tougher Licensing (like sourbastard said)
2. Tougher laws on 'unlicensed' drivers. (6-12months min)
3. More places to legally engage in your hobby - For those that it is a hobby/interest and not a way to show to other motorists on the streets.
4. Simply more police presence on our roads, and not hiding behind a tree with a speed radar so we can't see them.

I don't see how it is only the hoons being targeted here either, what about the countless number of 'oldies' that have come close to wiping me out? Mothers doing 60 through there childs school zone, or the couier driver that cut me off in there vans cause they think there bigger and better?

Truck drivers are some of the best here in Victoria, if i'm looking o overtake them, they indicate when the road is clear for me (of course i still do my own check but...), if they are coming behind me, i let them through and they say thank you, more then what i can say for the interstate drivers who come flying up behind you, sit on your ****, just so they can reach the boarder by 12PM.

Hoon laws are not culling the road toll, it's simply giving us 18-21 year olds something to challange!!

Your about right in everything you said. But where i live the pilice prescence is a joke! ive been pulled up 59 times in 20 months of my licence lol havnt been done for anything as suck but have had threats about my car and them saying anytime you muck up we will make sure you lose your licence...... 4 yellow stickers, 2 of the times taking my my car over the pits unchanged because it wasnt illegal in the 1st place....police presence is not a problem in some places in the cities i say it is, and my experience as a courier driver they dont hide the cameras, plus wel... actually the cameras are debatable on their accuracy. also DEFINATELY we should get somewhere for our hobbies, theyve got places for every other kind of hobby why not ours?

[Tuddy200]

I have noticed that police presence is extremly high in some areas, yet, where it is needed most there is hardly any. I think you brought another issue up, and that is "Do the police have too much power?" You mentioned 2 yellow's and nothing changing anyway, yet would they get into trouble for issuing them unfairly? Most likily not.

If there was a place open, late afternoon and during the evening then most of the "hoons" would be there and also if it was open Weekends/Early Mornings then we'd have somewhere to test our pride and joy's out (not being in the "hoon" catorgery).

If the police want to set-up 'fixed' cameras, on the inbound roads to the place, or have a breathe testing right outside the gates outbound after some events, I personally think they have a reason there, as they give us a place to do this, then we respect them by not drink driving or speeding on public roads. Sounds Reasonable to me.

Of course Ballarat has a local drag strip, but only available certain weekends where there are events being held. This sucks, because I know Ballarat probably has a fair amount of "hoons" and i'm probably on the "Hoon Hotline" Car Watch list myself after watching some lady take my number plate for some reason. (Still not sure why...)

[xbgs351]

Originally Posted by Nikk O'lass

Yeah, the need to show wreks of cars and stuff....


Example:
(Flash backs of 4 mates hooning around, laughing, driver does a handbrakie...
...show pictures of a car wrapped around a tree or pole of some sort, blood body on ground)

driver:20
Car: WRX
200kmh, 4 mates, one mistake...

now he has 3 less mates...

...his new wheels are on a chair.

And to top it off, he can't be a lover no more.

Dont be a ********.

(closing pictures of his girlfriend walking out...)

(blank out word is a more direct form of this: Richard Cranium)

Some friends of mine are in the SES and CFA and often attend road accidents. They reckon that after a bad accident or a fatality, they will modify their driving behaviour for about a week before returning to their original behaviour. If the real thing doesn't slow people down, how can a tv add?

[Tuddy200]

I have to agree with the above as well. First you have the i'm invincable attidude, then you get the, well "Now I know what happens when I do that, It can't happen to me again..." attidude.

You'll stop 10-15% with the ads, maybe another 10-15% with 'life' experience of an accident. You'll loose 25-30% with better licensing. To get your license, all you have to do is "fluke" your way through the test only once and you get it, where on average you could fail the test 4 out 6 times you may do it, but you only need to pass one. Cause an accident on your way home from the licensing center. :togo:

You'll loose 40-50% of "hoons" too if they had places to go, and the ones that don't respect that there were places to do it, and still "hoon" on the street deserve to have there cars taken and spend time in jail.

You could wipe 50-70% of bad driving/hooning/speeding just with proper licensing and more places for car enthuistists right there I believe. The polictics look at it from the point of view that they'd b encougaring hooning and speeding if they opened places like that though, so they opt to give more money to 'fixed' dodgey speed cameras and our roads in the country suffer too, which causes alot of accidents. All comes down to polictics and staying in the game.

[4.9 EF Futura]

To the thread starter - allow me to play devil's advocate... if i may...

Facts:
No useable drag racing facility exists in metro SA.
Legislation now makes punitive measures for reckless behaviour on the street extremely harsh.
It is government's job to cater for the best interests of the most people they can (to put this into a more realistic context - government will try and win as many votes as possible).
Drag racing facilities are not cheap to build or operate. Money spent on such a facility would be at the expense of alternative govt spending, such is the scarce nature of cash resources.

Assumptions:
People who want to drag race represent a small minority. Most people do not have any interest in doing so.... let's go for 85%. If you believe this to be different, let me know.

Concepts:
No one has the "right" to drive a car really fast.
No one has the right to a drivers licence - these are granted upon request, hence testing etc.
Everyone has the responsibility to adhere to the road rules (its a condition of the licence granted to you). NOTE: you do not have to agree with the road rules or the conceptual arguments behind them, but you are obliged to adhere to them.

So.

Considering the minority interest in driving cars really fast, the absence of any inherent right to do so, the role of government and the scarcity of cash resources.... why should they provide us a facility?

The argument that providing such a facility to prevent speed related deaths on the road... is fundamentally flawed. It assumes we have the right to drive really fast - when we clearly do not.

Hardly providing a solution focus here am i?

Of the top of my head, provision of such facilities would perhaps be better done by private enterprise.

[Tuddy200]

Correction: We don't have a "right" to drive "fast" on our public roads. If we choose to take our cars to a "place" where it is acceptable to drive "fast" then we have that right as the owners of the car.

Drag Racing Facilities are currently not cheap to build no, but if the goverment were to change from "vote grabbing idiots" to realistic "Life Saving Thinkers" then they'd take steps from the top down to improve the sitiuation.

Many of these drag racing facilities are already in place, but are not open to the public or at least regurarly.

Personally, there is also nothing wrong with the "hoon" laws, just that people are being such hoons because they have no where else to do so, on a regulary basis without breaking the world bank.

No one has a right to a license, you are correct, but current sitiuation is, that it's easier to get a drivers license then a credit card these days. I drove 20kms around town, in a new car, slowest time of the day for my P's test and it was obvious anyone who can drive reasonablly could pass it. I'd say hoons could keep a level head while passing such test and then soon as they have the license could get caught speeding 10kms away from th licensing center.

Why isn't there more emphises on driver training? Just because I did 40 hours on wet roads while raining doesn't mean I can drive safely or 'stop' safely if something happens.

- Driver Training
- Tougher Licenseing System
- More Facilities

We haven't even started discussing road conditions and speed limits on these roads, which are two seperate issues. Some road conditions are extremly poor, and they long streches of back roads which screams "try me" to the driver. Other roads are better then other, have less traffic on them then usual yet they have a lower speed limit then the others (and this is where they set-up road side camers).

I also hate they way some roads are with there signage of the speed limits. I'll use example of Ballarat to Horsham, which is a highway with speed limit of 100kms/h. It has 4 smaller towns along the way, and 2 major towns along the way. You could be doin 100kms/h straight on cruise and then come around the bend and see signs saying 60/70 (at times with a speed camera set-up after them) and your expecting to wipe 40kms off in 10-20 metres. I've seen police cars who are shocked by it, other who say "Get over it" its a case of clear revenue raising and it happens all over Victoria, if not Australia.

[DOC]

Originally Posted by 4.9 EF Futura

To the thread starter - allow me to play devil's advocate... if i may...
Facts:
.

All Valid in love and war and where there's a devil, angels will follow

Thoughts: I agree there will always be a two way discussion on the pro's and con's and it could go around in circles.

I also believe that you are correct when you say private enterprise should be ( or should i say ) will probably be the ones to tackle the problem if it happens. I also believe that if and when this happens you can bet your bottom $ if they get it half right the govt will be there saying " yes we can help as were to willing to support this so we also look good"

The thread starters view is that this whole bag of spin placed by the media on Hoon driving etc helps sells papers and i also believe the average person in the street has no way to be heard or will be heard, becuase this along with the speed camera's is one very big business for the govt.

Lets look at the stats in Victoria now, 1 million $ a day in revenue from speeding fines, ?

So how can the govt sit there and say we are getting tougher etc etc when there own figures now probably make more money than many companies, do we say the policies that the govt has put in place simply do not work,? and if they did work why in the blazzers do they predict higher revenue next year.

Can you honestly tell me there are that many bad victorian drivers, I don't think so and using the 85% rule id say this group are just normal mums and dads one or two K's over

What has this got to do with the hoon laws and SA ? , well being out left side you do not need to be blind freddy to see that SA is following Vic in the speed camera dept, like above its big business.

Secondly where it ties into the hoon laws and i may be wrong but if this hoon propoganda is splayed all over the place, all of a sudden the focus is moved from govts raking 1 million plus a day from jo blo to hey we are responsible and protecting the comminity, the old smoke and mirrors.

In that and as said in the old days it was meant to be if you got done speeding etc that money was put back into safer roads etc etc, now you can not even get a straight answer as to where the money goes, Does it go on driver training, better roads, improved signs, more support for younger drivers ? I think not

Also in SA as in Vic, why does our govt aslo predict higher returns from fines next financial year? , this question in itself is wanting for answers, are they saying thier measures will not work ?

But while as above the crap reporting on now less than 1% of the population taking up full pages in our papers with stupid tag lines such as and as quoted

Hoons " catch us if you can"
Day or Night they Just don't Care
Risking it all for a Buzz

Then fill half our crapomentry tv shows with the same garbage, then come and say we will get tougher to help protect the public, everyones focus is diverted from the other hand dipping in our pockets taking the millions.

[sexr6tasy]

Thats an interesting point doc and i get what your saying on one hand 4.9ef is saying its not worth the money to provide a place for "hoons" to do there spirited driving legaly. On the other hand the government is putting up speed cameras, toughing driving laws to catch these disgusting drivers to make a safe place for the other 99% of the population who dont hoon! isnt this a contradiction we wont provide a safe enviroment for it in s.a because it cost to much but on the other hand we will punish all who do it without mercy. As for driver training courses and extra license measures thats fine for all the people entering the system but what about the other 90% of drivers who already are in the system surly they should be made to do the driving courses aswell whats fair for one group is fair for another but watch how fast such a proposal from the government will get shot down by voters eg. you can make them do stuff like that but not me i got my license after 2 years on my p's and passed one test and ive been on the road 5 years im suddenly a tip top driver i dont need this fancy training sounds like another contradiction to me. Dont just target brand new learners and p platers, also target people who are already driving for driver training.

[DOC]

Yes, many questions from many questions, and it's bigger than all of us i am sure, with the speed camera stuff this has most drivers in theory being Hoons ( they speed ), but my bottom $ we will not see one full page spread on speeding drivers or any current affair programe go out and attack this section of the public as often as the so called hoons if at all, the back lash would be huge, better to just shift the focus to the !% real hoons out there.

Further can the govt show not 10, not 5 but 1 positive thing they have done to help these so called hoons other than to drive the wedge deeper.

yes i agree training and support should be there for all who want it.