Sydney motor show f****>>Up

[jonbays]

well i went to see the new BF at the Sydney motor show and asked for some info. was given a poster and I asked if they could send me a brochure on the XR6T.

Well today i get a BA MKII brochure in the mail.

Great work ford!!!

Holden made me que for the Monaro brochure but i got one.

holden had a show stand with a concept car and stole the show.

pity eh.

[rag top]

ha! you should have specified BF XR6T, not just XR6T!!!

[Black XR6]

Yeah, the people manning the ford display have NFI.

I was there checking out the BF GT that was sitting there. I was taking plenty of pics and showing interest. I was wearing a dress shirt with a GT logo on it from the old days, the same logo that is now used on the GT. One of the guys manning the stand saw me, walked up and said, bout time they got back to that emblem, and kept walking. He showed no interest in chatting to me about the BF. No interest in selling me one, or giving me a handout.

By contrast, Wulos and I were over at the Subaru stand and just standing there taking pics of the rally car replica they had there. We walked straight past their production display and were basically down the back of the display taking some pics of the rally car. A guy manning the subaru stand walked up and initiated conversation and offered us a brochure, which we took.

Lift thy game Ford.

Originally Posted by Black XR6

Yeah, the people manning the ford display have NFI.

I was there checking out the BF GT that was sitting there. I was taking plenty of pics and showing interest. I was wearing a dress shirt with a GT logo on it from the old days, the same logo that is now used on the GT. One of the guys manning the stand saw me, walked up and said, bout time they got back to that emblem, and kept walking. He showed no interest in chatting to me about the BF. No interest in selling me one, or giving me a handout.

Lift thy game Ford.

That attitude ****es me off. Yep I manned the stand and had NFI either.... :

Remember it was a MOTOR SHOW, not a dealership so why would anyone have to try and sell a car???? And if someone working there did, then I'm sure they would have been attacked for doing that as well. :yeees:
If you wanted to know something, why not ask? Or is it just another excuse to lay sh it on anything to do with Ford??

[gtfpv]

Originally Posted by RATT

That attitude ****es me off. Yep I manned the stand and had NFI either.... :

Remember it was a MOTOR SHOW, not a dealership so why would anyone have to try and sell a car???? And if someone working there did, then I'm sure they would have been attacked for doing that as well. :yeees:
If you wanted to know something, why not ask? Or is it just another excuse to lay sh it on anything to do with Ford??

no offence RATT but ford are my favourite car manufacturers but i asked 4 people if they new where the ford boss v8 engine is that is cut open showing its internals. i got a blank stare from 2 of them the other one said he wouldn't have a clue if they have one there and the 4th one told me to approach one of the dealers there and try to find out . well that plainly stinks.ilooked for myself and couldn't find it . the only reason i looked was because a friend told me he was looking at it the day before . and FPV GAVE ME RED FACES WHEN I ASKED THEM IF THE bf gt WAS HIGHER PERFORMING THAN BA GT . I ALSO ASKED ABOUT EURO III IS THE EXHAUST QUIETER IS THE INTAKE QUIETER .THE REPLY WAS NO . ASKING ABOUT PERFORMANCE THE GUY SAID HE DIDN'T KNOW WITH A RED FACE HE HAD 2 PEOPLE STANDING NEXT TO HIM SAYING NOTHING EITHER I COMMENTED THAT HE ISN'T ALLOWED TO DISCUSS THIS IS HE . and he nosdded with a smile . so you can be ****ed off as much as you like . a fact is a fact . i asked these questions at the HSV stand as well wearing my FPV singlet and they had no problem discuusing performance and exhaust fitments etc .

[max^power]

Originally Posted by RATT

That attitude ****es me off. Yep I manned the stand and had NFI either.... :

Remember it was a MOTOR SHOW, not a dealership so why would anyone have to try and sell a car???? And if someone working there did, then I'm sure they would have been attacked for doing that as well. :yeees:
If you wanted to know something, why not ask? Or is it just another excuse to lay sh it on anything to do with Ford??

True, i hate it when sales people only talk because they want to take my wallet, empty it into theirs and then give it back empty, then tell me i got a bargain. I can't stand this sales tactic and i let them know it :

If you don't ask, you'll never get!

[gtfpv]

yep i spoke to 4 people at the ford fpv stand in uniform . only 1 of them new that ford was a make of a motorvehicle that they were representing .

[zetec]

Originally Posted by jonbays

well i went to see the new BF at the Sydney motor show and asked for some info. was given a poster and I asked if they could send me a brochure on the XR6T.

Well today i get a BA MKII brochure in the mail.

Great work ford!!!

Holden made me que for the Monaro brochure but i got one.

holden had a show stand with a concept car and stole the show.

pity eh.

Either the details were taken incorrectly (they didn't select BF Falcon rather than just Falcon), or you should have received a cover letter stating that you'd also receive the new brochure once it became more readily available. My guess would be to visit http://www.ford.com.au/fordthinking/ to see if you can register for BF details or brochure there.

I myself worked the first 5 days of motorshow and I can assure you I had far more than NFI about the cars. I had a great time.

Fair enough, but my reply was to a different matter.

The guys you asked would have been sales people and at that point in time very few would have known anything relating to exhaust noise/ induction noise as the motor show would have been the first time they have layed eyes on a BF FPV, let alone having driven one. Performance wise, FPV haven't made anything clear to anyone.

I did not see a BOSS engine cutout when I was there last Monday either.

Oh and relating to performance, they do go better.

[Firefox7]

Originally Posted by jonbays

Holden made me que for the Monaro brochure but i got one.

holden had a show stand with a concept car and stole the show.

pity eh.

I go to the motor show, ...every year.....this year i did not....was I disappointed for not going,.... no...., I anticipated a Ford display that has transversed the same boring product for far to long...and i was right....all the boys that went, came home rather dissapointed.



Cheers.

[AUIII XR8 MAN]

Originally Posted by Firefox7

I go to the motor show, ...every year.....this year i did not....was I disappointed for not going,.... no...., I anticipated a Ford display that has transversed the same boring product for far to long...and i was right....all the boys that went, came home rather dissapointed.



Cheers.

I found the Motor show to be the same old stuff form everybody, you can miss a few years & go back & it still the same old stuff.

[NAK302]

Originally Posted by AUIII XR8 MAN

I found the Motor show to be the same old stuff form everybody, you can miss a few years & go back & it still the same old stuff.

you mean like the tv shows neihbours and home & away?

[Des]

Every motor show I've been to (and that's quite a few) you will always have some staff who have no(or little) idea what their talking about, (a certain Japanese Oz based manufacturer staffs their stand with models who need a seeing eye dog to find their own @rse!). I've found the Ford stand to generally be better than most. The only problem occurs when there has been a model released at the show and you ask pointed questions about specific performance and such outside of what the average Joe would ask.
Holden usually have no problem answering these questions as their cars are basically unchanged since the VT series one (which is based on the VN). So performance and such is basically unchanged.

[Transit Truck]

Compare the motor show to the boat show, completely different... You can get any question answered and place an order for one as well. Vehicle manufacturers should change the way they are thinking and have all relevant information available and maybe auction one up... Now thats Ford Thinking... NOT!

[fast66]

Originally Posted by Des

Every motor show I've been to (and that's quite a few) you will always have some staff who have no(or little) idea what their talking about, (a certain Japanese Oz based manufacturer staffs their stand with models who need a seeing eye dog to find their own @rse!). I've found the Ford stand to generally be better than most. The only problem occurs when there has been a model released at the show and you ask pointed questions about specific performance and such outside of what the average Joe would ask.
Holden usually have no problem answering these questions as their cars are basically unchanged since the VT series one (which is based on the VN). So performance and such is basically unchanged.

Don't sprout your ignorance about Holden products, the Commodore has developed at the same rate as the Falcon. I challenge you to tell me of one component of a VT which is the same as a VZ. (then do the same between AU and BF). And as for unchanged performance, wasn't there up upgrade from the Holden 5.0 to the LS1???
99% of us are here because we prefere the blue oval, but to say crap like that makes the rest of the Ford fans here look as ignorant as you.

[Des]

Originally Posted by fast66

Don't sprout your ignorance about Holden products, the Commodore has developed at the same rate as the Falcon. I challenge you to tell me of one component of a VT which is the same as a VZ. (then do the same between AU and BF). And as for unchanged performance, wasn't there up upgrade from the Holden 5.0 to the LS1???
99% of us are here because we prefere the blue oval, but to say crap like that makes the rest of the Ford fans here look as ignorant as you.

Hows this just off the top of my head:

1. Chasis hard points.
2. Basic suspension (though they did add two "links" and dropped the rigid axle, then re-engineered to add it back for some utes)
3. Door openings (especially rear)
4. Most, if not all of the floor pan.
5. Manual Gearbox
6. 4 speed auto (though they have added a heavy duty version)
7. Basic dash structure

Most, if not all of the above has been changed on the Falcon over the same period (needed to be as well). To the point that Holden are now behind the eightball. The VE will be the first all new Commodore since the VN, therefore, today's Commodore still has parts of the VN underneath.
My post stands.

[MethodX]

Overdoing it a bit much there arent u?
Both companies use parts from previous models.

The VT is a distant relative of the 95 Opel Omega, THe VN a relative of the 88 Opel Omega

[fast66]

Originally Posted by Des

Hows this just off the top of my head:

1. Chasis hard points.
2. Basic suspension (though they did add two "links" and dropped the rigid axle, then re-engineered to add it back for some utes)
3. Door openings (especially rear)
4. Most, if not all of the floor pan.
5. Manual Gearbox
6. 4 speed auto (though they have added a heavy duty version)
7. Basic dash structure

Most, if not all of the above has been changed on the Falcon over the same period (needed to be as well). To the point that Holden are now behind the eightball. The VE will be the first all new Commodore since the VN, therefore, today's Commodore still has parts of the VN underneath.
My post stands.

Are you blind? or as I suggested just ignorant.

AU Falcon -> BF Falcon
1 - All chassis hard points are the same
2 - Falcon still using Live rear from XD or even earlier in the ute series (with coils instead of leaf) Commodore was the first to introduce IRS accross the board (as crap as it is). Now falcon has IRS
3 - Actual doors are the exact same. Same as the roof.
4 - Entire floor pan exactly the same.
5 - Commodores manual gearbox updated from 5 speed to 6 speed. and now new 6 speed for 6 cyl. Similar situation for falcon.
Commodores auto now a five speed (up spec models) Same as falcon (6SP)
6 - Commodores dash structure is completely new from VT/VX to VY/VZ, same situation for Falcon.

What about engines?? the Current 4.0 is a evolution of a 170CU USA motor from the sixties. Same as the 3.8 in Holden, (now a brand new 3.6 V6.
Both camps V8s, updated.

So no, your post does not stand, it highlights that your opinions of the red brand are based on inaccurate information, and that makes your assessment invalid. My point is that both the falcon and commodore have developed at the same rate. Funny about that, given its the same pool of engineers that design both, and the same suppliers who make the parts!!
The fact that Ford had to spend so much means that we should have a better product than Holden (which we all think we do), but Holden still sells more cars, so why would they go and spend heaps of $$$ when the market tells tham they dont have to. If Falcon suddenly came along and started to sell more cars, don't you think Holden would do something about it?? $$.

You are obviously one of those blind Ford fans who thinks the BA was an all new Falcon, instead of a $500,000 000 update to a product that the public hated. And as such has put the development of a new Falcon platform back at least 5 years.
Make no mistake, when VE is released, Ford Australia will be in for a world of pain. There is no "ALL new Falcon platform" on the horison (to the same extent as VE). Ford will be competing against VE with a platform that is 10 years old, albeit with major (costly) updates. No matter how good we think the Falcon is, its not a fair comparison, and will get thumped.
Don't get me wrong, I love my Fords, but I hate listening to one sided inaccurate arguements. It does nothing for our brand except show us as being ignorant. No doubt the Holden forums are guilty of the same, but does that mean we must aswell? :

[Black XR6]

Remember it was a MOTOR SHOW, not a dealership so why would anyone have to try and sell a car???? And if someone working there did, then I'm sure they would have been attacked for doing that as well.

They dont have to try to sell a car on the spot. They DO however have to engage the public in talking about their product and thus creating interest in it which leads to sales. That is what the motor show is for PR. If the people manning the stands just stand there like the cars, why have them, may as well have booth babes who know nothing at all about the product.

The guys you asked would have been sales people and at that point in time very few would have known anything relating to exhaust noise/ induction noise as the motor show would have been the first time they have layed eyes on a BF FPV, let alone having driven one. Performance wise, FPV haven't made anything clear to anyone.

Well, thats another whole topic. Why release a car and not pre-inform the people who are responsible for selling the product its details. What you say is akin to if I walk onto a dealership the first day the BF FPV range is released and ask several pointed questions. They wont have any idea because they havent had time to read the brochures. I realise the staff at the ford stand are volunteers, but that dosnt help them sell product or even discuss the product with the public. Any car on display at the motor show should be well known to the staff manning the stand or else it looks rather poor that they dont know their own product.

Say what you like, I still say the Ford display and the way it is run and handled leaves a lot to be desired. Its just my opinion based on my experience there.

Maybe Ford should ask only the most knowledgable people to man the stands? Right now they ask dealers to send a few members of staff to the show for atleast half a day and without any idea how good the people are for that job.

I was happy to talk to anyone as was Matt (zetec). But at the same time some questions that were asked were strange.

[Black XR6]

Yes, that is a great idea Ratt. What were some of the strange questions asked?

[Polyal]

ah! all this non sense over the motorshow is driving me crazy.

You guys are part of a minority that know alot about how the cars work, mods, etc etc. Do you seriously expect ford to get some engineers who are busy working on program stuff to man the stand at a motorshow. I think some people seem to forget its a SHOW, not an interview.

If you want info then ask for it, or look it up, but dont expect someone who might be from sales, marketing, finance etc etc to know the internals of the BOSS motor, or what the induction noise is liek compared to the BA...lol..even some engineers wont be able to tell you that because its not their field.

There will be some sales/marketing etc guys/girls who know there stuff and can answer some in depth questions. But thats not what they are there for exactly.

99.9% of the people will ask very generic questions like is it quicker than a holden? how much does it cost (even though there is a sign); can you pop the boot? just general stuff like that.

When I did it I had a ball, I would get home and not be able to talk because sometimes I will get people who will talk for ages, literally 30mins. Its great, but can be tiring, espically when you get a smart **** who thinks he knows it all and you have to go along with it as to not offend them.

[Full Noise]

Originally Posted by Polyal

Do you seriously expect ford to get some engineers who are busy working on program stuff to man the stand at a motorshow. I think some people seem to forget its a SHOW, not an interview.

Yes I do. As a mater of fact I can remember talking to Gordon Barfield, that’s right, the bloke who’s on page 47 of the current Blueprint magazine. He was manning the stands at the Melbourne Motor Show a couple of years back. Not only does he freely give his time to the FPV & XR Club for our meetings, he is also willing to get out there and get his hands dirty. I can’t speak for the last Motor Show, as I couldn’t be stuffed going, however, some of the bigwigs actually do this sort of thing down here.

As far as I’m concerned, if there are people on a stand they should know at the very least the basics about the product. Not some person saying “ they come in blue and green” other than that I don’t know because I work in the canteen at Ford.
My 2c

Cheers, Danny

"Why don't Ford build a Falcon with a 4cyl?"

"Why isn't the XR6 or 8 available with gas?"

[Falchoon]

Originally Posted by RATT

"Why isn't the XR6 or 8 available with gas?"

Seems like a fair enough question to me especially when n/a XR6 makes up over 20% of all (BA) Falcon sales. Maybe Ford would actually sell some XR8s if they were more affordable to run.

[Polyal]

Originally Posted by Falchoon

Seems like a fair enough question to me especially when n/a XR6 makes up over 20% of all (BA) Falcon sales. Maybe Ford would actually sell some XR8s if they were more affordable to run.

hmm..it would be avery silly move. It would cost big bucks to re-engineer the 4v to suit a gas application, and how many would you sell?

Prove me if I am wrong, but when someone buys an XR8, fuel economy isn't exactly a piority; its a bonus.

[gtfpv]

Originally Posted by Polyal

hmm..it would be avery silly move. It would cost big bucks to re-engineer the 4v to suit a gas application, and how many would you sell?

Prove me if I am wrong, but when someone buys an XR8, fuel economy isn't exactly a piority; its a bonus.

agreed.....

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by Falchoon

Seems like a fair enough question to me especially when n/a XR6 makes up over 20% of all (BA) Falcon sales. Maybe Ford would actually sell some XR8s if they were more affordable to run.

In the cars guide last Friday there was an article about Ford thinking of optioning the LPG engine in XR6 and Fairmont, so it may happen.

[Black XR6]

Thats my point full noise. The people manning the stands should be able to answer most questions. Not just a couple, but all of them. The motor show isnt there to sell cars directly but it sure is there to assist sales.

It is one place where all the manufacturers are under one roof. If I was tossing up between buying a falcon, camry, commodoore, lexus, or liberty etc. I could walk around to my hearts content talking to the various companies directly. The knowledge the people at each stand could give may be the deciding factor in the purchase.

[XA Coupsta]

Spot on. Imagine how easy it is (or should be) to research your next purchase across a wide range of manufacturers by going to the show. It would come down to who does the best job of representing that vehicle to that buyer is quite possibly going to make a sale due to that.

Some buyers might only want to know what colours it comes in, some buyers (like us) will want to know a lot more.

And I find it a little contradictory that there has been comments made that it is a motor show and not a sales show - they arent there to sell cars - yet then apparently it is sales/marketing staff manning the booths?? Have I followed it correctly?

I would have thought the perfect solution would be to have both sales persons AND technical experts on hand. Cant miss then.