V-facts For November

[PETE_XR6]

How were the sales for last month?

[Dave_au]

Car sales lock up as gloom darkens

* Barry Park
* December 4, 2008 - 10:44AM

The AGE

Car sales have taken a dive for the fourth month running, casting a pall over what is expected to be a year that many car makers and importers will be hoping to forget.

- Car sales slump - again
- Fourth consecutive month of falls
- Worst result in about eight years

Today, the gloom turned a significant shade darker, with sales for November slumping 22.2 per cent, according to data released by the Federal Chamber of Automotive Industries.

The data was released a day late due to a "processing delay" created by one car company.

The slump is the worst since the introduction of luxury car tax in mid-2000 when the market fell more than 11 per cent as buyers held off purchases until cars affected by the tax became cheaper.

It eventually recovered to post a commendable 1.8 per cent overall decline for the full year.

Sales for November fell 9.4 per cent compared with an October described by one industry veteran as a black month for the industry.

Sales fell 11.4 per cent in October compared with the same time last year. In August, it had fallen 12.3 per cent compared with the same month last year, while September saw a 3.1 per cent fall.

All passenger car segments were down, with the mid-sized car segment - the staple ground of the likes of the Toyota Camry and Ford Mondeo - suffering the least with a 15 per cent fall.

The large car segment - which includes family car staples including the Holden Commodore, Ford Falcon and Toyota Aurion - fell 21.1 per cent, the figures show.

Worst hit were upper large cars, the part of the market in which the Chrysler 300C and the Holden Caprice sell. It was down a staggering 63 per cent.

Light cars, the trading ground of vehicles such as the Toyota Yaris and Holden Barina, fell 19.9 per cent.

Soft-roaders were also hard-hit, falling 28 per cent overall. Sales of large off-roaders such as the Toyota LandCruiser were slashed in half, falling 50.8 per cent for the month.

Luxury soft-roaders - the trading ground of vehicles such as the BMW X5 - were hard hit, falling 40.2 per cent.

Car makers are struggling with growing stocks of unsold vehicles, the result of now distant optimism that sales would easily exceed the 1,049,982 vehicles that rolled out of showrooms last year.

Stock ordered months ago is still coming off foreign production lines and pouring into Australian ports, with Toyota alone admitting it was holding onto a stockpile of more than 40,000 cars.

With two more months of the year remaining, the FCAI is still expecting vehicle sales for the year to exceed the one million mark - just.

FCAI chief executive Andrew McKellar said it was clear that people were being more cautious with their money in light of the global financial crisis.

"Certainly the most recent interest rate cut was well justified and it is hoped this will help restore some confidence and stability to the marketplace,'' Mr McKellar said.

"On the upside, there are going to be some very competitive opportunities for anyone considering buying a car in the near future."

Following the release of last month's figures, sales for the year are expected to hit 1.019 million, down 160,000 sales on the previous month's estimates.

The growing pessimism in the local motoring industry reflects a similar, but harder hitting, slump globally.

In the US, car makers are in deep strife. Earlier this week, Chrysler revealed that its sales fell by a staggering 47 per cent last month, while Holden's parent company, General Motors, saw its sales crash at 40 per cent down for the second month running.

Over at Ford, the company marked an unbroken, year-long run of declining sales, falling 37 per cent for the month.

Nissan also saw its sales slide 42 per cent for November in what is shaping up to be the worst run for US car retailers in 25 years.

Even luxury brands gaining a foothold in the US are not immune. Sales of Aston Martins fell more than 40 per cent and Porsches by almost 50 per cent, prompting the German sports car maker to close down its factory for eight days in January.

BMW was the best of the US luxury brands, suffering only a 27 per cent slump.

US lawmakers today began planning ways to quickly bail the big US car makers out of trouble if any of them decided to seek Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection.

[balthazarr]

Originally Posted by Dave_au

...
Car sales have taken a dive for the fourth month running, casting a pall over what is expected to be a year that many car makers and importers will be hoping to forget.
....

I just read another Age article this morning that suggested this year was shaping up to be the second best year ever.

Aaahhh... journalism.

[Dave_au]

Originally Posted by balthazarr

I just read another Age article this morning that suggested this year was shaping up to be the second best year ever.

Aaahhh... journalism.

Well it was good for the importers when the dollar was worth more than 90c US, local manufacturing has had a shocker.

[SB076]

Originally Posted by balthazarr

I just read another Age article this morning that suggested this year was shaping up to be the second best year ever.

Aaahhh... journalism.

I presume they are talking calender year, and the calender year will look good as most of the sales success was earlier in the year. If they are talking financial year then its way to early to make that call. However we are seeing large percentage drops in sales and who knows when the market (for selling cars) will improve

I never could work out how Australians managed to buy 1 million cars in a year, given our population is 20 million

[charles_wif_xf]

Any specific numbers yet?

[EgoFG]

http://www.businessspectator.com.au/...W?OpenDocument

Originally Posted by bs

Toyota Motor Corp again held the top sales position in November with a 24.4 per cent share. It holds 23.5 per cent of the market for the calendar year so far, compared to 22.4 per cent at the same stage in 2007.

The Holden unit of General Motors Corp took second spot in November with a 13.6 per cent share, while Ford Motor Co came third with 10.1 per cent.

[EgoFG]

And from Last months thread

% Market Share Oct 08
Toyota 23.6
Holden 12.9
Ford 10.8

So Holden Grew market share (by about 6%) through 'give aways'. Ford slipped by 7% of their Oct Market Share (10.8 to 10.1). Toyota also Grew by about 3%.

Seems odd, cannot wait for the Model specific figures

[irlewy86]

Originally Posted by EgoFG

And from Last months thread

% Market Share Oct 08
Toyota 23.6
Holden 12.9
Ford 10.8

So Holden Grew market share (by about 6%) through 'give aways'. Ford slipped by 7% of their Oct Market Share (10.8 to 10.1). Toyota also Grew by about 3%.

Seems odd, cannot wait for the Model specific figures

Thats total market share, I dare say the big decline in luxury and prestige cars is propping up the bread and butter makers share, despite losing sales.

[EgoFG]

http://www.thewest.com.au/default.as...ntentID=111465

Toyota was the top selling company last month with 17,473 vehicles, ahead of Holden on 9749 and Ford on 7233. Toyota also led the market overall with 219,984 vehicles, compared to 119,520 for Holden and 97,216 for Ford.

October was


Ford 8,880


holden 10,631

Toyota 18,165

[RATT]

Sorry I'm late..

Ford (NOV 2008 v 2007)

Ford Courier 4X4 0 5
Ford Escape 86 160
Ford F250 4X2 1 6
Ford Fairlane 6 97
Ford Falcon 2,555 2,798
Ford Falcon Ute 719 1,326
Ford Fiesta 307 356
Ford Focus 1,172 1,271
Ford Focus Coupe Cabriolet 35 33
Ford LTD 0 1
Ford Mondeo 327 159
Ford Ranger 4X2 527 566
Ford Ranger 4X4 547 688
Ford Territory 763 1,595
Ford Transit 138 91
Ford Transit Bus 16 7
Ford Transit C/C 34 60
Ford Total 7,233 9,219 (down 21.5%)

Holden

Holden Adventra 0 4
Holden Astra 940 1,406
Holden Astra Convertible 44 131
Holden Barina 845 1,002
Holden Caprice 101 223
Holden Captiva 623 936
Holden Colorado 4X2 443 0
Holden Colorado 4X4 575 0
Holden Combo 62 82
Holden Commodore 4,365 4,573
Holden Epica 366 290
Holden Monaro 2 2
Holden Rodeo 4X2 33 848
Holden Rodeo 4X4 26 829
Holden Statesman 89 137
Holden Utility 4X2 904 1,538
Holden Viva 301 497
Holden Total 9,719 12,498 (down 22.2%)

[prydey]

Originally Posted by RATT

Sorry I'm late..

Ford (NOV 2008 v 2007)

Ford Courier 4X4 0 5
Ford Escape 86 160
Ford F250 4X2 1 6
Ford Fairlane 6 97
Ford Falcon 2,555 2,798
Ford Falcon Ute 719 1,326
Ford Fiesta 307 356
Ford Focus 1,172 1,271
Ford Focus Coupe Cabriolet 35 33
Ford LTD 0 1
Ford Mondeo 327 159
Ford Ranger 4X2 527 566
Ford Ranger 4X4 547 688
Ford Territory 763 1,595
Ford Transit 138 91
Ford Transit Bus 16 7
Ford Transit C/C 34 60
Ford Total 7,233 9,219 (down 21.5%)

Holden

Holden Adventra 0 4
Holden Astra 940 1,406
Holden Astra Convertible 44 131
Holden Barina 845 1,002
Holden Caprice 101 223
Holden Captiva 623 936
Holden Colorado 4X2 443 0
Holden Colorado 4X4 575 0
Holden Combo 62 82
Holden Commodore 4,365 4,573
Holden Epica 366 290
Holden Monaro 2 2
Holden Rodeo 4X2 33 848
Holden Rodeo 4X4 26 829
Holden Statesman 89 137
Holden Utility 4X2 904 1,538
Holden Viva 301 497
Holden Total 9,719 12,498 (down 22.2%)

dug up last months sales. what amazes me is the fact that regardless of which car the media says is best, the commodore still manages to sell plenty.

Ford- OCTOBER 08 v 07
Ford Escape 132 174
Ford F250 4X2 3 9
Ford Fairlane 14 95
Ford Falcon 2,747 2,439
Ford Falcon Ute 1,071 1,005
Ford Fiesta 402 453
Ford Focus 1,387 984
Ford Focus Coupe Cabriolet 55 19
Ford Mondeo 318 277
Ford Ranger 4X2 680 647
Ford Ranger 4X4 651 722
Ford Territory 809 1,190
Ford Transit 212 125
Ford Transit Bus 18 30
Ford Transit C/C 68 36
Ford Total 8,567 8,206 (up 4.4%)

and

Holden OCTOBER 08 v 07
Holden Adventra 0 4
Holden Astra 1,067 1,118
Holden Astra Convertible 58 95
Holden Barina 855 1,056
Holden Caprice 119 218
Holden Captiva 785 1,093
Holden Colorado 4X2 560 0
Holden Colorado 4X4 913 0
Holden Combo 77 87
Holden Commodore 3,810 4,440
Holden Epica 302 320
Holden Monaro 0 7
Holden Rodeo 4X2 82 716
Holden Rodeo 4X4 84 751
Holden Statesman 80 182
Holden Utility 4X2 970 877
Holden Viva 409 451

[RATT]

Toyota

Toyota Aurion 1,481 1,797
Toyota Avensis 47 105 908
Toyota Camry (4 cyl) 1,820 2,088
Toyota Coaster 15 28
Toyota Corolla 3,486 4,109
Toyota Hiace Bus 213 232
Toyota Hiace Van 531 954
Toyota Hilux 4X2 1,345 1,767
Toyota Hilux 4X4 2,075 1,920
Toyota Kluger 929 1,206
Toyota Landcruiser PU/CC 440 484
Toyota Landcruiser Wagon 554 1,170
Toyota Prado 986 929
Toyota Prius 282 266
Toyota RAV4 1,011 1,245
Toyota Tarago 105 251
Toyota Yaris 2,153 2,405
Toyota Total 17,473 20,956 (down 16.6%)

[csv8]

The BA Mk 2 sold more than the FG !!! wtf !!! comparing nov to nov sales !!!! FORD needs to get thier act together ASAP !!!!

[Dave_au]

Originally Posted by csv8

The BA Mk 2 sold more than the FG !!! wtf !!! comparing nov to nov sales !!!! FORD needs to get thier act together ASAP !!!!

What can they do? There's little money left for massive advertising campaigns, there's little interest left in the large car segment, there is a stigma against the Falcon. Here's a bit of fun and it would be good to see whether anyone can come up with a brilliant idea.

Hypothetically:

Your a director and board member of FoMoCo Australia.

You have at most 60m to spend. You have no further project funding from your overseas parent:

Scenario
The FG falcon's sales growth has slid, and is well below sales expectations when you consider the car is in the growth phase of it's product cycle. The majority of sales go to fleets, however fleet orders have fallen dramatically as fleet managers express concern over resale and reliability issues. Your nearest competitor (Holden) has such an issue with oversupply of vehicles that they have resulted to massive discounting in drive away deals. In addition, private purchaser interest in the large car market is sliding to record lows.

Meanwhile, your small and mid-car fleet is holding somewhat of it's own against the Japanese, but sales could improve. The EuroFord's represent the upcoming stars of the brand, and there is rumored domestic production starting in 2010. Public appeal in this market continues to grow.

Last but not least your previous sales star, the Territory, has a mid-life series update in March 2009. The update probably should have been more thorough, however your team has made the best of a bad situation and has updated as much sheet-metal and interior features as possible with the funds available.

Your parent company in Detroit is about to hit the wall. If the $60m was spent on advertising, this would pay for at most 5 weeks of advertising on TV.

Qu: Which project get's the funds:
The previous star (territory)
The previous cash cow (falcon)
The potential star (eurofords)
And in what area is the $60m spent.

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by csv8

The BA Mk 2 sold more than the FG !!! wtf !!! comparing nov to nov sales !!!! FORD needs to get thier act together ASAP !!!!

Have you been in a cocoon for the past 3 months? the ENTIRE auto industry is in a slump, not just Ford.
Throwing money at the problem wont solve it.

[Swordsman88]

As expected Red Ink all over the shop. It is also interesting to look at just where the manufacturers are hurting.

While Ford has been going quite well lately, this month they did lose alot of market share. BUT, it was due to falcon ute (tradies) and territory (families), which were at HALF their 2007 numbers. Most other losses were small or even sales held steady. this to me says that as expected, the financial situation is biting hard and fuel prices (which were high when these cars were being ordered) weren't helping. Tradies got in early with FG utes (good early sales) and are finishing up for this year (witness poor VE ute sales), and private buyers aren't interested in teh current climate. The old age of the territory (new one merely months away) hasn't helped.

Look at the competitors is interesting. Holden is down on commdore, but with the shocking deals they are doing not surprising they are holding ok i suppose, plust liquidation of floor stock going on due to financing. But toyota lost alot of ground on corolla, as did holden with astra. Ford didn't lose much at all with Focus. That new advertising campaing might have helped there???

The only real positive was Hilux for toyota, which held up ok, but so did Ranger (coloradao vs Rodeo didn't go well for holdne though???).

Things a bit all over the place really but it is down down down for everyone.

[The Monty]

People are just holding onto there money a little more coming into christmas. Falcon is doing ok, the utes and the Territory are suffering BAD.

[Smoke Pursuit]

Its down, but the Falcon utility should be a BIG cause for concern with Ford.... I cant see why it has dropped so much!

Can't believe there are still monaros available for RETAIL... geebus 2 years later!

[tapeworm]

It's not cool seeing the Holwoo range still outselling the superior Ford comp in the various classes. Listeners were blown away on the 3AW motoring segment today at Paul Govers opinion of the Mondeo being superior to the Epica, he said it was attributed to Holdens superior marketing getting their product name out there.

[Swordsman88]

Originally Posted by tapeworm

It's not cool seeing the Holwoo range still outselling the superior Ford comp in the various classes. Listeners were blown away on the 3AW motoring segment today at Paul Govers opinion of the Mondeo being superior to the Epica, he said it was attributed to Holdens superior marketing getting their product name out there.

OMFG, Gover said a Ford was better than a Holden..... Tell me it aint so, the world must be coming to an end for real (massive storm in brisbane right over the house right now, so yeah....LOL!).

Realistically, it is not just an issue of marketing skill/dollar. Companies pay big cash for their advertising and no advertising company knowingly does a 'bad job' as people on here claim. Ford has alot less cash to spend on its marketing (part of the reason holden doesn't make any cash is its crazy advertising budget), but also has a brand image problem.

Its been said before but perception is what matters. Toyota has it in spades, their ads are mostly about the latest deal they have going, not building brand. Holden has brand too, even those that don't like it won't come out and bag the 'aussie workers'..... Ford is trying to build its brand beyond making taxis into small/medium cars and quality euro-fied products, plus get straight up sales. I'm not saying they have bene perfect but It aint' easy and i think alot of people need to pull their head in and take stock of what ford is up against before pilloring 'ford marketing'. Hey, at least we can hold our heads up as Ford fans - can't say the same for 'holwoo' as you put it tapeworm!

[tex]

Falcon ute figure is most concerning. Combined with Falcon sedan figures, things look mighty crook atm.

[vztrt]

Ford 2555 +719 + 763 = 4037
Holden 101 + 4365 + 89 + 904 = 5459

Not good in the aussie built segment, mind you companies are waiting to see how this financial crisis will pan out. Holden are either doing great deals (and cutting their throats) or they are just a heap mor popular.

[Gobes32]

A quick question..... How many of those "sold" commodores are sitting at Fowles in Melbourne? People who drive past there will know what I mean. Rumors getting around at the moment are that Holden register the cars therefore they qualify as a sale............

[phillyc]

Originally Posted by Gobes32

A quick question..... How many of those "sold" commodores are sitting at Fowles in Melbourne? People who drive past there will know what I mean. Rumors getting around at the moment are that Holden register the cars therefore they qualify as a sale............

Holden are probably trying to hold onto the number 1 for Commodore for 1 last year before Corolla gets it on a permanent basis.

[Rodp]

Originally Posted by Gobes32

A quick question..... How many of those "sold" commodores are sitting at Fowles in Melbourne? People who drive past there will know what I mean. Rumors getting around at the moment are that Holden register the cars therefore they qualify as a sale............

What would be the point of that? Qualifies as a sale doesn't put money in the bank and you've just devalued the car enormously.

[prydey]

i was reading in another thread that fords are largely 'made to order' whereas the holdens are made first and then sold? if this is correct maybe all the cars the dealers 'buy' and which are still sitting around the many yards around the country, are inflating the sales figures.

[vztrt]

Originally Posted by prydey

i was reading in another thread that fords are largely 'made to order' whereas the holdens are made first and then sold? if this is correct maybe all the cars the dealers 'buy' and which are still sitting around the many yards around the country, are inflating the sales figures.

Ford will build the ordered models and then if they dont have enough for a full days run they will build models that are lacking.
Holden will have alot more cars lying around because they have been building alot more cars then Ford and didn't react quick enough to the global slowdown.

[phillyc]

Originally Posted by vztrt

Ford will build the ordered models and then if they dont have enough for a full days run they will build models that are lacking.
Holden will have alot more cars lying around because they have been building alot more cars then Ford and didn't react quick enough to the global slowdown.

Ford have reacted better not only globally but also locally it seems. Their stock control is quit good from most reports and they didn't have massive orders for imports so although sales might be down, at least there is less to discount to move.

Toyota has admitted that it has over 40,000 vehicles in excess of requirements. Which, in a perverse way, would mean that they have 2months worth of stock bought at the old imported / dollar prices.

Holden is rumoured to have 20,000 Commodores out to pasture. That is 5mths worth of stock. No wonder they are offering $29,990 driveaway deals and massively cutting back production (albeit too late).

[Smoke Pursuit]

Originally Posted by Rodp

What would be the point of that? Qualifies as a sale doesn't put money in the bank and you've just devalued the car enormously.

Dealers register demos to get more bonus / depreciation on them.. Holden instructed most dealers to registered all 07 VE's to get further bonus money on them, and help move them...

Ford does the same thing, but I believe holden has a alot more 07 plate stock left then Ford atm.